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CO_17thRecon
Kell Hounds
Major
Joined: 10-Sep-2002 00:00
Posts: 1297
Location: United States
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 Posted: 28-Dec-2007 00:53 Post subject: Engine Choice |
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I'm curious. I've gone from using XLs in everything to XLs in nothing when designing. While I do like the variety of having put together non-XL versions of many expensive machines, I'm cooling a bit from my anti-XL frenzy. While I realize many of the players here are proponents of Level 1 play, I am not. But, I'm still curious as to which engine to use when.
For instance, my command 'Mech. A heavy moving 5/8 gets me lots of armor and weaponry to command my force...but if I lose a torso, I'm hosed.
On the other hand, getting an Axeman with an XL for someone in my force seems like a good bet. Though slow, the Axeman will only be fighting on its own terms...ie, an ambush force. The extra weaponry there could break the enemy before they ever get a shot off.
So...what's the policy usually? When is it good to use an XL engine? What criteria must be met for it to be worth the expense and inherent weakness?
For that matter, are the same criteria (or similar ones) in effect for Clan-tech engines and Light engines?
I'm interested in the open discussion here, since Inner Sphere XL's are a tough choice. The weight is seductive, while the fragility is less tempting. The good news is that I have plenty of time to mull it over. The group's not even to the war of 3039 yet, so I have plenty of time to think.
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Jarylan Blackwell
"What the...?! Where did you get THAT?!"
"Creative aquisition."
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 28-Dec-2007 03:50 Post subject: Engine Choice |
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I only limit myself by time eras and by technology available to intended users. If I want to get the XL engine, I simply put it in. I only try to avoid XL engine for vees...
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The dragon NEVER sleeps!
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Mordel
Mordel.Net
Administrator
Joined: 03-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 6087
Location: United States
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| Posted: 28-Dec-2007 09:27 Post subject: Engine Choice |
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I generally don't like inner sphere XL engines because of the fact that you lose a torso and your gone. With that said, one of my favorite designs; the Penetrator, has an XL engine. As does one of my others; the Wraith. Both server vastly different purposes and are used in vastly different ways.
As a general rule though, I would not put an XL engine in something that is gonna be the primary target. As much firepower as you can pack on a 100 ton machine with an XL, it all means nothing when the combined fire of your enemy tears it up in 2 turns. This is especially more true if playing a Cost or BV game as that one mech will account for probably 60% of your total. Then you've got squat left. 
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CO_17thRecon
Kell Hounds
Major
Joined: 10-Sep-2002 00:00
Posts: 1297
Location: United States
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| Posted: 28-Dec-2007 11:01 Post subject: Engine Choice |
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Well, cost is a factor, since we're doing the bookkeeping for the unit(s). Keeping the logistics in mind means you keep a good watch out for a thumb on the scales.
Basically, the not being shot at part covers a lot. Ambush 'Mechs don't have time to get shot at much before they finish the job. Scout 'Mechs should be too fast to be shot. Support 'Mechs are too far away to be shot.
(A lot of the above falls apart against Clan opponents, but what doesn't?)
Generally, anything used for breaching missions, or holding the line should be standard in that case. Which means the majority of "trooper" 'Mechs I use, including the Enforcer, Dervish, Wolverine and others. Ironically, that also rules out Assaults equipped with XLs, except maybe for a special case here and there. Though they could benefit from most, they also tend to be massive targets.
Also Mordel, the Steiner-Davion Penetrators all carry standard engines. I checked.
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Jarylan Blackwell
"What the...?! Where did you get THAT?!"
"Creative aquisition."
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Knightrunner
Clan Snow Raven
Star Commander
Joined: 20-Jul-2005 00:00
Posts: 123
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| Posted: 28-Dec-2007 11:07 Post subject: Engine Choice |
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I find that the extra vulnerability of XL's is rather minor, even for IS mechs. By the time a side torso is completely destroyed, there usually isn't enough left of the rest of the mech to make much difference. Bad luck can sometimes drop an XL mech when a standard engined mech would survive, but overall the extra fagility is more than offset by the weight savings. The risks with ammo explosions are no worse than for Lvl 1 mechs- or even less if padding the area around the ammo with double heat sinks.
With light engines or clan XL's, the dangers are actually quite slim compared to the potential gain. Always assuming, of course, that the weight saved isn't squandered. On a ton-for-ton basis, an XL engined mech should be able to outlast a standard engined machine by trading superior capabilities for increased fragility.
On the other hand, if you're buying your mechs with c-bills, the XL quickly loses its luster. Instantly doubling the cost of the mech is harsh medicine!
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Blackhand
Draconis Combine
Chu-i
Joined: 05-Jul-2002 00:00
Posts: 334
Location: Canada
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| Posted: 30-Dec-2007 16:31 Post subject: Engine Choice |
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Depends what kind of mechs I have. Anything with only 10 points of armour on a location gets an XL normally. Since if a Guass or ER PPC hits it it'll pop anyway.
I usually don't like XLs in my line mechs. My line mechs are Dervishes, and Panthers, and Whitworths.
I'll give XL to scouts almost exclusively but usually I'm playing under a restrictive budget that sees less than a third of my force be mechs. The other third being Vehicles. The final third being infantry, and the bits and pieces missing filled in by Aerospace.
So I don't usually see the point of spending 10 million or so on a medium mech when I have to equip so many other things.
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Seraph
Blighted Sun Battalion
2nd Company
"Seraph's Slaughter"
Major
Joined: 11-Mar-2004 00:00
Posts: 1744
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| Posted: 30-Dec-2007 19:46 Post subject: Engine Choice |
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That is a rather hot topic. hmm.. to XL or not to XL...
It would depend on what I am doing.
Usually in a campaign setting I would be against the XL because of costs. Besides the up-front cost of the equipment, your techs are going to have to get extra training on the maintenance and repair of it and/or hire a tech who is proficient in their particulars. The vulnerability does not enter into the equation at all.
If it is an arena/duel, then I am usually more apt to use an XL for the extras I can get for the tonnage of the machine. I my experience, and as stated before, by the time I am looking at the destruction of my own torso then I am most usually done for anyway.
Couple of extenuating circumstances...
I would use an XL in a campaign if my techs could also alter the Mech in other ways. Such as scouts. If I am going to shove an XL engine into one I am gonna make sure I get one that comes real close to matching the tonnage of the standard engine I am pulling out. The Mech will then be a much faster unit and potentially have room for extra sensors. Who cares how fragile a scout is, if he is taking his machine into combat for on reason other than to fight it out then I am going ot be in the market for a new scout pilot regardless of the outcome of the fight.
I would avoid an XL engine in an arena/duel if I had no leeway in the bv and needed to fit a certain kind of mech. Ergo..I need a hard hitting jumper.
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