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jymset
Scavenger
in pursuit of LosTech
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 956
Location: Germany
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 Posted: 24-Jul-2007 07:18 Post subject: Looking at "lvl1" & Clan stuff amongst the IS units of 3050U |
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Hey guys. I am one of those old-timers who is stuck in the long-gone days of 3025. When the Clan invasion arrived, I swapped sides. Thus, I will always prefer a 3025 game to a 3070 one, but when I do play with new toys it is as an honourable Falcon (besides, I could never chose a favourite house in 3025. As of 3050, my choice was obvious - I loved the Falcons even back when they were nobody's favourite poster-boy Clan).
Erm....clunky intro aside, I love 3050U with a passion. After having delved into all the new Clan variants, the next thing that struck me as supremely interesting was the hints at "lvl1" (now a defunct term) designs. Going hand in hand with that, I also noticed a few hidden Clan upgrades of IS or SL stuff. Thus, the following is a quick run-down of what i noticed - I would love to get your input on those. At first, I looked at all the SL mechs and commented on those in view of TRO:3025R. I then deleted all the ones apart from the ones where there was an obvious discrepancy, or where there was a new insight.
So, what do you think?
IS lvl1 - 3025 stuff
(Thorn – the -S variant is actually a downgrade of the -N variant supplied by ComStar to the Dracs in the war of 39. However, the 3025R text still stands, as Ford continued its existence and did build the original model predating the -N, called the -F!)
Trident – this was in continued production, later on with standard armour.
Commando COM-1B – a subject of many, many fan-made speculative designs, we finally get the official LL-armed lvl1 variant! Boy, a 25-tonner with a LL and twice as much armour as the FLE-4! I can see this one becoming a quick favourite!
Nightshade – a SSW model is described, without the ECM. What about the FFA? It would make for an interesting alternative for….the Peregrine?
(Spad – 3050U confirms that this was in continued use by the Great Houses during the SWs!)
(Zero – this other lvl1 fighter, on the other hand, was described as having been lost during the SWs…. it matters not, I for one, much prefer the Spad!)
Rogue – seeing as it did not upgrade the HS to double, could the Lyran dual-PPC variant of the 2nd SW actually be a lvl1 design? But then, looking at the Alacorn variants, I somehow doubt that the armour is downgraded.
Kuritan Hatchetman? It says they used their own version of the -3F, without ejection system. I dare say that the in-game stats remain identical?
THK-33 Tomahawk – the initial prototype was lvl1. Also, with the wide proliferation of the design, one could conceivably field this in a special scenario.
(Crab – just a brief mention, as this one is specifically mentioned as having survived all the SSW in great numbers, making it one of the few legit SL mechs that could be used in any given 3025 scenario.)
HCT-212 Hellcat II – a downgraded SW model! I actually really like it, the extra HS really does help a lot!
Kanga – technically, this had always been a lvl1 tank, with the exception of it utilising lvl3 construction rules. A break-down of the jump system during the SSWs is noted.
(Hoplite HOP-4B – this was released in the 4th SW Battlepack. I am kinda disappointed in the fluff-text here. It always seemed obvious to me that this was the original design, what with the integral 16 HS. Just one? Unsuccessful? I don’t buy it.)
(Kintaro – TRO:3050U strongly suggests that this design was not in use anymore until redistributed for the war of 39!)
Gotha – between the 3019 version with standard armour, as well as the -100 series, I am confident that we will see a lvl1 sheet of this fighter, which apparently is one of the mainstays of the FWL.
Lancelot – who’d a thunk? The new fluff supports 3025R fully…. In addition, we get a variant fielded by the other houses. In downgrading the Lancelot AC5s were made the main weapons. The model is called the -03 and I’m looking forward to it (as described below for the Cataphract).
Marksman – yes/no? Much of the text talks about an older, slower, heavily armoured SSW variant that was not all that successful…
CTF-4X Cataphract – the reason for this post. Wow, this one I’m excited about! A “new” heavy design! 2 AC5s, 1 LL, 1 LRM5 – WTF, this is a Cataphract? But I like that load-out, I really do. See, I’m an unapologetic fan of the AC5 in lvl1 play and will happily argue about the validity of that weapon. The speed dropping to 3/5 is more worrying. This one ought to be cheap, BV wise, and controlling heat won’t be a problem.
(Grasshopper GHR-5N – also a no-longer new design, this one totally rocks. As a field variant, it isn’t really confined to any time period or, indeed, any specific house.)
(Black Knight – 3050U in no way supports 3025R – where there was talk of shutting the plant down after the raid of 2802, 3025R says the lvl1 variant started waltzing off the line as of 2809, while 3050U retcons that and makes it clear that after 2802, only spare parts were manufactured.)
(Rhino – always a lvl1 design, the text does confirm that this did, in fact, serve with all the houses – CONTINUALLY, until the present day! A lvl1 variant replacing the LRM10 with an SRM6 and an assortment of small AP weapons is discussed.)
RPR-102 Rapier – an unsuccessful SW variant built on Tharkad. Why unsuccessful? Surely this is more impressive than the Chippewa?
Shogun – so….not! Man, I’m still waiting, hoping, praying that there will be an all-3025 variant of this in the new RS volume!
(Ahab – while the prototype is all lvl1, the text reinforces that these have not been seen in hundreds of years. Much like the Tomahawk or Zero this is only conceivable in special scenarios.)
Original Daboku – is this lvl1 or not? If so, it should be interesting giving this one a run on a 3025…er 3038 battlefield.
(Highlander – 3050U clarifies that the -733 [as described in 3025R] is in fact the downgrade supplied by ComStar to the Dracs in the War of 39 – it is *not* a SW model)
(King Crab – not only does 3050U fail to mention any -0000 variant, it also decidedly does not mention GM ever producing this. I am happy about this, as I really cannot see this as a Davion flagship during the SWs. On an unrelated note, I love how there is a variant, the 010, that is clearly there to set up a setting of snubbies within the context of a SL design!)
stated Clan upgrades of IS designs
(I am hoping that there will be more, ie unfluffed/unstated upgrades in the RS)
Swift – a simple Clan upgrade does exist. Just new lasers (and, I assume, armour).
Falcon FLC-6C – wow, a very tough light sniper! Judging by the text, this really is used only by the Dragoons or, rather, the WoB.
(Firefly C – this one already existed, but now it’s confirmed that “All of the invading Clans employ…” it “…with their second-line forces.” Sure makes this Falcon happy – just looks-wise, this is one of my absolute favourite!)
Tomahawk C – this mounts Clan lasers and uses the free tonnage for an upgrade of both HS and armour.
Kanga – the HH used it as a base for the Hephaestus. Apparently, it is now also to serve as a base for a new WiG combat vehicle?
(Hoplite C – another pre-existing design, this is another one that does not belong to the Clans… It is a post-Luthien upgrade.)
Thor – the Clan examples use upgraded materials (armour, ERML).
Champion C – a fully pimped Clan version awaits us! It was originally deployed with the Invading Clans, but is uncommon now. But whoa, an XL allowing a pulse upgrade of the lasers and the “installation of additional armor and weaponry” just sounds really…interesting!
(Burke – the text supports the picture in Crusader Clans – the Burke is, apparently, one of the backbones of the Horses’ heavy armour stars. A possible Clan upgrade is not discussed, however.)
(Annihilator C – this wasn’t commented on. Seeing as it was introduced by the Dragoons to the IS, it is fairly safe to assume this is in fact a standard Clan 2nd line design.)
(Imp C – this one is mainly used by the Star Adders.)
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"Rear armour is defeatist!" - unknown Kuritan Mechwarrior
The AC5 is a great gun!
On heat, 3025 style:
A Rifleman knows no heat.
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Mordel
Mordel.Net
Administrator
Joined: 03-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 6042
Location: United States
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| Posted: 24-Jul-2007 09:36 Post subject: Re: Looking at "lvl1" & Clan stuff amongst the IS units of 3 |
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| jymset wrote: |
So, what do you think?
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I haven't really looked at any of the Upgrade mechs or even played with them yet, so I can't say.
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Mordel Blacknight - Site Administrator
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AWAD
Draconis Combine
Chu-sa
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 766
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| Posted: 02-Nov-2007 13:39 Post subject: Re: Looking at "lvl1" & Clan stuff amongst the IS units of 3050U |
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| jymset wrote: | Hey guys. I am one of those old-timers who is stuck in the long-gone days of 3025. When the Clan invasion arrived, I swapped sides. (Thorn – the -S variant is actually a downgrade of the -N variant supplied by ComStar to the Dracs in the war of 39. However, the 3025R text still stands, as Ford continued its existence and did build the original model predating the -N, called the -F!)
Commando COM-1B – a subject of many, many fan-made speculative designs, we finally get the official LL-armed lvl1 variant! Boy, a 25-tonner with a LL and twice as much armour as the FLE-4! I can see this one becoming a quick favourite!
Lancelot – who’d a thunk? The new fluff supports 3025R fully…. In addition, we get a variant fielded by the other houses. In downgrading the Lancelot AC5s were made the main weapons. The model is called the -03 and I’m looking forward to it (as described below for the Cataphract).
CTF-4X Cataphract – the reason for this post. Wow, this one I’m excited about! A “new” heavy design! 2 AC5s, 1 LL, 1 LRM5 – WTF, this is a Cataphract? But I like that load-out, I really do. See, I’m an unapologetic fan of the AC5 in lvl1 play and will happily argue about the validity of that weapon. The speed dropping to 3/5 is more worrying. This one ought to be cheap, BV wise, and controlling heat won’t be a problem.
stated Clan upgrades of IS designs
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I stumbled over this old post and it peaked my curiosity.
First Jymset, you are a traitor. Inner Sphere or nothing. You just wanted the biggest baddest toys if not old scholl 
Me, even Level 2 it must be IS. Hell I even will push goody two shoes Davion before I touch clan.
But I have never bought any revised TR other than the one TR3025 eons ago in which the old unseen had to be gotten rid of and they put in TR2750 as TR 3025 mechs.
Touching only on the Mechs I may have to get this.
I have made and seen 25tons with just a LL or LL+ second weapon and they rock. Interesting they finally made one. But I just have a hard time seeing it as a commando. I hate when a missile boat becomes a laser boat or vice versa.
Lancelot and Thorn. Need to look at those.
The Cataphract rules. It is an ugly Frankenstein mech and the new load out is wonderful. I can easily see this as a Liao defensive Mech. Also can actually do 20 points, not easy, but a good 5-12 range fighter.
AWAD- Any one can win in a clan Mech, it takes a true Mechwarrior to drive and win in Lvl 1 Mechs.
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jymset
Scavenger
in pursuit of LosTech
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 956
Location: Germany
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| Posted: 21-Nov-2007 13:09 Post subject: Re: Looking at "lvl1" & Clan stuff amongst the IS units of 3050U |
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| AWAD wrote: | First Jymset, you are a traitor. Inner Sphere or nothing. You just wanted the biggest baddest toys if not old scholl
Me, even Level 2 it must be IS. Hell I even will push goody two shoes Davion before I touch clan. |
 I joined the hobby at a time when the Refusal War was "the" event of Battletech. The Falcons were my first and lasting love. Hey, cut me some slack. Back then, when everyone and their grandma were Wolf fans, being a Falcon fan was original!
The mech I fell in love with was the Thor illustration out of the Compendium. Even though it was marked Wolf...and guess what, as soon as I flicked through 3050, it turned out to be a Falcon design. Serendipity...
Anyways, that is my excuse for liking the Clans in 3050+ days. But as far as my real love for the hobby goes, that is soooooo linked to TRO 3025. The Blackjack, the Vindicator, the Wolverine, the Rifleman, the Jagermech (just looks wise), the Zeus - those are the designs that really, really get my juices going! [<-- edit: exchanged "flow" with a much less disgusting "go"]
Have you caught the announcement on CBT? That they will now release TRO 3039? Time for a new thread?
Anyways, I wrote the above thread back before the RS were released and as such it was all conjecture. Which means:
Sorry to burst your bubble. They screwed up the sheet for the Lancelot. It is a (really really strange) lvl2 design.
Another burst bubble: the -4X is the first production variant that the DAVIONS put out after capturing one of the Cataphract lines.
But hey - at least the Commando still carries an SRM-2!! 
| AWAD wrote: | | AWAD- Any one can win in a clan Mech, it takes a true Mechwarrior to drive and win in Lvl 1 Mechs. |
jymset, and yes, real men drive Locusts!
_________________
"Rear armour is defeatist!" - unknown Kuritan Mechwarrior
The AC5 is a great gun!
On heat, 3025 style:
A Rifleman knows no heat.
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