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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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 Posted: 11-Apr-2005 18:02 Post subject: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Okay looking for some input on this one as to either improve it or if you like it as is fluff it...let me know what you think about it. I am thinking of maybe adjusting the missiles to a small type or going with ACs or more engery weapons, not sure yet....
BattleMech Technical Readout
Type/Model: Firebow
Tech: Clan / 3067
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 2, Standard design
Mass: 100 tons
Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 400 XL Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
3 ER PPCs
2 Adv. Tact. Msl. 12s
1 ER Small Laser
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)
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Type/Model: Firebow
Mass: 100 tons
Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 152 pts Endo Steel 7 5.00
(Endo Steel Loc: 3 LA, 2 RA, 1 LT, 1 RT)
Engine: 400 XL Fusion 10 26.50
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 20 Double [40] 8 10.00
(Heat Sink Loc: 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 LL, 1 RL)
Gyro: 4 4.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H R: Sh+UA+LA+H 16 .00
Armor Factor: 307 pts Ferro-Fibrous 7 16.00
(Armor Crit Loc: 3 LA, 3 RA, 1 LT)
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 31 46
Center Torso (Rear): 16
L/R Side Torso: 21 32/32
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Arm: 17 34/34
L/R Leg: 21 42/42
Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
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1 ER PPC RA 15 2 6.00
1 ER PPC LA 15 2 6.00
1 Adv. Tact. Msl. 12 RT 8 15 8 10.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 LT, 2 RT)
1 Adv. Tact. Msl. 12 LT 8 5 7.00
1 ER PPC CT 15 2 6.00
1 ER Small Laser HD 2 1 .50
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TOTALS: 63 77 100.00
Crits & Tons Left: 1 .00
Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 30,337,834 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,583
Cost per BV: 11,745.19
Weapon Value: 5,032 / 5,032 (Ratio = 1.95 / 1.95)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 39; MRDmg = 33; LRDmg = 17
BattleForce2: MP: 4, Armor/Structure: 8/6
Damage PB/M/L: 8/5/4, Overheat: 4
Class: MA; Point Value: 26
_________________
Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Apr-2005 20:57 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Okay thought you folks would be all over this one...
_________________
Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Blackhand
Draconis Combine
Chu-i
Joined: 05-Jul-2002 00:00
Posts: 334
Location: Canada
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| Posted: 12-Apr-2005 21:15 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Eh, I'm not liking the ATM 12s. Or the time period. But, meh, its not like I'm going to shoot you down and comment because of that 
ATMs especially the larger racks always struck me as trying too hard. As you can usually fit a decent size LRM and SRM rack in and thus be more useful.
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Apr-2005 21:44 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Quote:
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On 2005-04-12 21:15, Blackhand wrote:
Eh, I'm not liking the ATM 12s. Or the time period. But, meh, its not like I'm going to shoot you down and comment because of that
ATMs especially the larger racks always struck me as trying too hard. As you can usually fit a decent size LRM and SRM rack in and thus be more useful.
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How so? The ATMs have different ammo types without having to get a whole new system or extra stuff as would the SRMs or LRMs if they use Art IV or V or Streak, none of which work with each other and can be jammed via ECM of one type or another, and the Clans are limited on ammo types for the missiles anyways with Thunders big the only other kind they have, so wouldn't the variable ammos for the ATMs give them a huge advantage over the LRMs/SRMs?
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Delta
Lyran Alliance
Leutnant
Joined: 11-Dec-2004 00:00
Posts: 635
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| Posted: 12-Apr-2005 21:54 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Whats not to like about ATMs Blackhand? 5-10-15, 2 damage a rocket with built in Art IV, and the ER and HE ammo?
That on top of the 3-ERPPCs make it lethal.
My only bug is that it isnt a great heat handler at alpha strike, but the sheer mass of fire it can shoot at you if it doesn't fire all 3 PPCs compensates for that. I like it...
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Blackhand
Draconis Combine
Chu-i
Joined: 05-Jul-2002 00:00
Posts: 334
Location: Canada
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| Posted: 12-Apr-2005 23:44 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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17 tons for two ATM 12 and 15 shots total
16 heat to fire, 2 chances to hit
13 crits, 3 of ammo.
24 damage with ER rounds possible
48 damage in mid range.
72 damage in close.
17 tons
2 SRM 6 with Artemis IV and 15 shots total
2 LRM 15 with Artemis IV and 16 shots total.
18 heat to fire, 4 chances to hit.
13 crits, 3 of ammo.
30 damage with LRMs possible
30 damage possible in mid 12-15 range.
54 damage possible in close 9 and in range.
Main differences. The ATM have half the ammo amount but a higher damage potential if you have the right ammo. The LRM, SRM mix has more ammo but lower damage curve and a greater # of shots to roll. Also with twice the endurance on your ammo bins with twice the number of vollies per round you;'ll average out more damage over the course of your ammo bin all rolls being bell curved.
Also not analyzed was 5 SSRM 2s splitting 50 shots as it will weigh as much as 2 SRM 6 with Art IV.
I can see the ATM 3 being the most useful out of the three, as mathmatically it beats most of the other clan missile systems. 6 and 9 remain competitive as well. The 12 is the lug that is hard to make work.
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Apr-2005 00:26 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Okay and using four LRM5 w/wo Art IV beats a single LRM20 w/wo Art IV....yet folks and the offical mechs, still mount LRM20s over multiple LRM5s.
With the ATMs you get one system that can do multiple things, from hitting to hitting far away all with in the same turn or on the next one, were as a LRM equipped mech can't really do that unless it get's closer.
To me the different ammo types aviable to the ATMs gives it a more useful role over the LRM/SRM combo.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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StarRaven
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 01-Jun-2004 00:00
Posts: 1138
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Apr-2005 00:43 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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I like the triple PPCs. You don't have the heat sinks to alpha strike with them often, especially with the ATMs there too, but that's not much of a problem. There's more to life than alpha striking.
I think that the ATMs have insufficient ammunition. You might want to consider dropping something or downsizing the ATMs (since there's not much to drop) so you can pack in some more ammo.
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- Attributed to General Aleksandr Kerensky
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Apr-2005 01:18 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Dropping them down can be an option.
_________________
Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Stinger
The Knights of Chaos
General
Joined: 30-Apr-2002 00:00
Posts: 1833
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Apr-2005 02:31 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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I wouldnt mount a ATM with less than 3 tons of ammo. That gives a ton of each range bracket. Or 1 ton ER ammo and 2 tons HE ammo.
Either way you look at it the ATM is a far superior weapon.
_________________
Stinger
If it's "creepy" to use the Internet, military satellites, and robot aircraft to find a house full of gorgeous young models so I can drop in on them unexpected, then FINE, I'm "creepy". Howard Wolowitz. BBT.
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Blackhand
Draconis Combine
Chu-i
Joined: 05-Jul-2002 00:00
Posts: 334
Location: Canada
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| Posted: 13-Apr-2005 19:17 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Actually 4 LRM 5s with Art, loses to 1 LRM 20 with art when you run the numbers.
So meh. lol. Its a decent design. I just question why people make a stand on things they don't run numbers on.
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 17-Apr-2005 21:01 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Quote:
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On 2005-04-13 19:17, Blackhand wrote:
Actually 4 LRM 5s with Art, loses to 1 LRM 20 with art when you run the numbers.
So meh. lol. Its a decent design. I just question why people make a stand on things they don't run numbers on.
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Running the numbers? How many book mechs match up to the numbers? I don't min/max mechs, they have flaws and they their strong points, if I want the numbers and the min/max then I would never use missiles, or ACs and have nothing but pulse weapons, Targeting computers, enough heat sinks to fire all day for 100 years and a crack pilot who is -10 on both piloting and gunnery and has natural gunnery as a skill.
So running the numbers does nothing to impress me nor does it say anything for your or anyones else's ability to make a mech or be the expert. It's an opinion and that is all.
_________________
Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Blackhand
Draconis Combine
Chu-i
Joined: 05-Jul-2002 00:00
Posts: 334
Location: Canada
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| Posted: 17-Apr-2005 23:13 Post subject: RE: Firebow Clan Mech |
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Man, its a game. I'm an alegebra genius who works security and construction. All I have time to do is crunch numbers and write bad poetry and stories.
I don't mean anything insulting. But, I probably do mean to come across as agressive and over bearing and arrogent. Makes my conversations shorter .
I don't mind it, I just pointed out my opinion and backed it up with fact when asked why I disagreed with the weapons to back up the trio of ER PPCs.
As for -10, -10 characters. Most of my characters are so skilled up in other areas I'm lucky to be Inner Sphere standard for most of my campaigns. I don't play Battletech or other RPGs for the combat.
My favourite DnD character PC is a Drow EXPERT. 2nd favourite was a Rogue/Ranger/Cleric. I prefer versitility to the most combat effective.
I just view that playing with the biggest edge possible is the best if I have to get into combat. As for perfect cannon mechs, some of the Archers and Crusaders come close. The TAG, ER PPC Panther rocks as well. The Jenner and Javelin Laser versions kick serious tail. The much maligned Rifleman is awesome, so is the king of the 3025 skies, and its Shadow Hawk buddy.
Bout the only designs I refuse to touch are the 7/11/7 evil liao machine of pulsing death, and the TC Pulsed machines you see Hohiro and a few others using in cannon stories.  Christofori's Penetrator and such.
I have a lot of respect for Avanti and his Angels. My command mech for my DCMS regiment is about the same idea. I'm rambling and I'm on my way out the door. Take care, and be happy man.
Take a look at my Grasshopper or Mauler mods or maybe my Crusader 5K. I just have fun designing things, but I feel if I'm going to offer an opinion on any mech to help make it better. I'm going to say my piece and back it up with fact.
[ This Message was edited by: Blackhand on 2005-04-17 23:15 ]
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