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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5792
Location: United States
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 Posted: 05-Jul-2002 23:28 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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lyrans with c3i, targeting comp, er medium laser, and swords...........
davions with streaks, mrms, c3i, er medium lasers, and light engines......
marik with streaks.....
mercs with streaks.....
whats up with that?
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8081
Location: United States
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| Posted: 05-Jul-2002 23:32 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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Welcome to Battletech 
_________________
www.210sportsblog.com
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2104
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 00:01 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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On 2002-07-05 23:28, Vagabond wrote:
lyrans with c3i, targeting comp, er medium laser, and swords...........
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It's called wanting to make money (er meds), Cosmtar allies (c3i), taking tech from "friends" (targeting computer)...now, as for the sword...which 'Mech? I still need to get the 3067 TRO, so my only source is chaosmarch...
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davions with streaks, mrms, c3i, er medium lasers, and light engines......
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Good relations/older tech for streaks, MRMs...they make their own ER Meds, IIRC...taking tech from "friends" (light engines)...
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marik with streaks.....
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Older tech...now spread out...
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mercs with streaks.....
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See above...
Remember, ER Meds and streak-4s and 6s have been around for around a decade now (3067)...plus, they should start making their own, considering how much Clan salvage has been gained by EVERYONE...
Ruger
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 01:54 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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Quote:
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On 2002-07-05 23:28, Vagabond wrote:
lyrans with c3i, targeting comp, er medium laser, and swords...........
davions with streaks, mrms, c3i, er medium lasers, and light engines......
marik with streaks.....
mercs with streaks.....
whats up with that?
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It's called an Arms Races and prolifration of technology to keep the fans happy with new toys to play with.
In other words some one forgot what made BT what it is and added in new weapons and the folks who make the mechs forgot that tech takes time to catch on in the military and thus we have everyone and their brothers using and making what ever they want.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Cadet
ComStar
Lieutenant, SG
Joined: 17-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 495
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 11:15 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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Think of it as Battlefield salvage and reverse engineering along with massive arms trading...
...or think that those who run the game are complete idiots.
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I'm not family friendly. That's why I don't post here.
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2104
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 12:12 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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On 2002-07-06 01:54, Karagin wrote:
It's called an Arms Races and prolifration of technology to keep the fans happy with new toys to play with.
In other words some one forgot what made BT what it is and added in new weapons and the folks who make the mechs forgot that tech takes time to catch on in the military and thus we have everyone and their brothers using and making what ever they want.
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I see...so, the advanced jets that we came up with in the 50s, thanks to our own research efforts that had been going on for years and then were given boosts by receiving captured advanced tech and research, were products from "folks who...forgot that tech takes time to catch on in the military and thus we have everyone and their brothers using and making what ever they want"...same with advanced tanks...the A-Bomb, etc...
Oh, ok... 
Ruger
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 15:38 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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On 2002-07-06 12:12, Ruger wrote:
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On 2002-07-06 01:54, Karagin wrote:
It's called an Arms Races and prolifration of technology to keep the fans happy with new toys to play with.
In other words some one forgot what made BT what it is and added in new weapons and the folks who make the mechs forgot that tech takes time to catch on in the military and thus we have everyone and their brothers using and making what ever they want.
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I see...so, the advanced jets that we came up with in the 50s, thanks to our own research efforts that had been going on for years and then were given boosts by receiving captured advanced tech and research, were products from "folks who...forgot that tech takes time to catch on in the military and thus we have everyone and their brothers using and making what ever they want"...same with advanced tanks...the A-Bomb, etc...
Oh, ok...
Ruger
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70% of jet tech was based of German Research...and NO we didn't give it away the second we came up with things either, BUT that is what happens in BT...everyone has the new tech with in a year.
But I am sure you have your version of things and I call it as I see if you dont like it then that is your opinion.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
[ This Message was edited by: Karagin on 2002-07-06 19:36 ]
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Sir Henry
Team Bansai
Senior Tech Specialist
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4899
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 17:33 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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I'ts called creative aquisition.....
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Sir Henry
A Dragon in the disguise of a bunny, is still a Dragon.
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Culverin
Draconis Combine
Gunsho
Joined: 15-Apr-2002 00:00
Posts: 97
Location: Canada
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 18:24 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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it called once its deployed.
there are too many worlds to guard your new tech with.
spec ops will get it.
hell, the lyrans stole the light engine from the dragoons.
and NOBODY is better than WolfNet (sorry a little biasedness slipped in there  )
_________________
War fought without respect is but a massacre.
Culverin, Lord of the Munchkins
Culverin's Domain
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2104
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 20:38 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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On 2002-07-06 15:38, Karagin wrote:
70% of jet tech was based of German Research...
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Not quite, IIRC...but didn't I say part of the reason we got the jets was because of captured research?
Yes, I see that I did...
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and NO we didn't give it away the second we came up with things either, BUT that is what happens in BT...everyone has the new tech with in a year.
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Really? Let's see...Light Gauss, MRMs, Streak-4s and 6s...developed circa 3055 to 3058...just appearing in numbers on units belonging to other nations circa 3065?
Yep...that's "within a year"...
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But I am sure you have your version of things and I call it as I see if you dont like it then that is your opinion.
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Hmmm...you DO remember who you are talking to on this?
How often have I complained about people's designs having state-specific tech on them?
No, if it's something that has just been passed to a specific nation techwise, then, yes, I do expect it to only be found on their machines...but if it's something that's been out there for a decade? Then I expect it's gotten around...especially if you manage to capture examples or have bought samples, etc...
10 years is plenty of time to reverse engineer something...hell, even targeting computers on Lyran machines and the like or Heavy Gauss Rifles on Davion machines within 5 years are understandable as these nations are still trading tech and production...
Ruger
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 00:13 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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Ruger seeing how you are trying ONCE again to start something, I am bowing out and leaving you the last word since you will not allow anyone else to have an opinion on anything that isn't agreeing with yours.
So have a nice day.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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CampingCarl
Free Worlds League
Master Sergeant
Joined: 24-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 176
Location: United States
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| Posted: 09-Jul-2002 14:12 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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On 2002-07-05 23:28, Vagabond wrote:
lyrans with c3i, targeting comp, er medium laser, and swords...........
Us Lyrans can afford whatever we want
davions with streaks, mrms, c3i, er medium lasers, and light engines......
They got it from the Lyrans, during the commonwealth.
marik with streaks.....
They always have lots missile stuff.
mercs with streaks.....
They can just buy it. For people that dont have a lot of money I would think that not wasting ammo would be a plus.
whats up with that?
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jymset
Scavenger
in pursuit of LosTech
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 956
Location: Germany
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| Posted: 10-Jul-2002 04:22 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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Well, I got TRO: 3067 on the week-end, and am very happy with it. There are a few things that struck me as odd: Like 2 very similar Davion Wolverines, and 3 RAC Marauder upgrades. Ruger, once you get this book, I'd love to go through it with you, one for one.
There is only one really bad gripe I have with it, because I do agree that technology would get spread a bit: The Scorpion-S. Now this is obviously a House STEINER upgrade. It carries the S in its name! It has a Light Engine! Now, if we remember, it specifically said in TRO: 3025 that the Scorpion was quickly becoming outmoded, and that Steiner was the first house to have officially adopted a line of scrapping their remaining Scorpions!!!! Ok, I love the upgrade and usually I'm not picky, but what? How can one so DIRECTLY contradict oneself? All previous errors seemed to be of an editing type. But this one?
But don't get me wrong. I really love the new RS. It's great to see new toys on the best 'mechs of all time. It's just that this is an error that I feel is particularly bad.
_________________
"Rear armour is defeatist!" - unknown Kuritan Mechwarrior
The AC5 is a great gun!
On heat, 3025 style:
A Rifleman knows no heat.
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Sir Henry
Team Bansai
Senior Tech Specialist
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4899
Location: United States
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| Posted: 10-Jul-2002 07:43 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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This is Battletech we're talking about....Right.....
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Sir Henry
A Dragon in the disguise of a bunny, is still a Dragon.
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2104
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| Posted: 10-Jul-2002 19:29 Post subject: OK i got a couple of gripes....... |
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On 2002-07-10 04:22, jymset wrote:
Well, I got TRO: 3067 on the week-end, and am very happy with it. There are a few things that struck me as odd: Like 2 very similar Davion Wolverines, and 3 RAC Marauder upgrades. Ruger, once you get this book, I'd love to go through it with you, one for one.
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Well...I know the stats of the Marauder-9S by heart...
As for the others, I've got access to them through chaosmarch (and can also ask some of their designers (I guess I should include Randall in that) about their thought processes on that) so that should be sufficient...however, time might be a constraint right now...I only get on a few hours in the evening during the week (leave for work at 6 AM and don't get home until 4 or after depending on when I get to leave and then have to spend alot of time going over posts on the Classic BTech website...weekends have more time...but not this one as I have to fly to Wisconsin this weekend until next Friday for a training class and don't think I'll have access to a computer until then once I leave....I'm already dreading the number of posts on Classic BTech when I get back)...
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There is only one really bad gripe I have with it, because I do agree that technology would get spread a bit: The Scorpion-S. Now this is obviously a House STEINER upgrade. It carries the S in its name! It has a Light Engine! Now, if we remember, it specifically said in TRO: 3025 that the Scorpion was quickly becoming outmoded, and that Steiner was the first house to have officially adopted a line of scrapping their remaining Scorpions!!!! Ok, I love the upgrade and usually I'm not picky, but what? How can one so DIRECTLY contradict oneself? All previous errors seemed to be of an editing type. But this one?
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Well...I know one thing is that they were simply trying for a couple upgrades for each minimum...I personally probably would have made it a Wolf's Dragoons 'Mech, but there you are...
Maybe somebody found a surplus of them at an old Brigadier storage facility and decided to refit them and send them into the field to fight in the Civil War rather than scrap them as they needed every 'Mech they could lay their hands on?
Hmm...just looked at it and it has endo...
ok...retract that last statement....make it a refit of the Star League era design, dropping the ER LL it had in its LT and the Artemis IV system on its SRM-6 so that it could install the heavier Light engine rather than the XL that was to go in the Star League version...these were found in a cache almost completed, but lacking the ER LLs, the XL engines and the artemis, so the refit worked perfectly...
Hey, it's an idea...
Another idea falls in line with the above...if you notice, 3025 also says that most surviving Goliaths were in the hands of House Steiner...Goliaths and Scorpions were made by the same corp...say they found factory, repaired it and started producing the 'Mechs with their best versions (the experiemental ones that never saw the light of day during the Star League, but are now being released), perhaps slightly moddied for newer tech that the SL never produced...
I'll try to think of better excuses...
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But don't get me wrong. I really love the new RS. It's great to see new toys on the best 'mechs of all time. It's just that this is an error that I feel is particularly bad.
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Perhaps...
I must say that I REALLY like some of the upgrades...I already listed most of those I really liked in a thread for Old Dog to review...
Oh Ancient Hound...have you taken a gander at that list and at Chaos March yet?
Ruger
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