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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1919
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 Posted: 04-Apr-2003 22:30 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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On 2003-04-04 21:15, Gangrene wrote:
There was a Btech comic book?
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Several different series in fact...starting with "The Spider and the Wolf" graphic novel and continuing on with some series put out by Malibu comics (IIRC) and maybe some other companies...they were back when the Clans first arrived on the scene I think...
Ruger
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1919
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| Posted: 04-Apr-2003 22:40 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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What does that mean? No revamping of our game. It would require too much effort (game mechanics aside, just converting all those mechs and being able to create new ones would be a major hassle)
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Are you saying that it would be a major hassle to convert the CBT 'Mechs to ClickBase 'Mechs, or vice versa?
If you mean the former, well, that is somewhat being done already, with more 'Mechs added in each booster edition, including the Reseen Locust in the upcoming Death from Above expansion (remember, this can't all be done overnight...what we've gotten for CBT has been acquired over almost 20 years of the game)...if you mean in the reverse (ie, MWDA 'Mechs with CBT stats), I direct your attention to the MechWarrior Dark Age 1: Record Sheets books, now on its way to the distributors...it should have most, if not all of the MWDA 'Mechs released thus far done up in CBT stats...
Trust me...there is alot of crossing back and forth going on...CBT is not dead, nor is it a junior partner to MWDA (except, perhaps where novels are concerned...then again, MWDA doesn't have sourcebooks as yet, because CBT is doing the sourcebooks, and we haven't reached 3130 yet)...they are really equals, and many people working with one game also work with the other...
Trust me, I think you will be VERY pleased with some of the stuff that is coming up for Classic BattleTech  ...this game is nowhere near dead, nor is it a forgotten middle child in this equation...
Ruger
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Gunslinger Patch
Royal Black Watch Regiment
Major
Joined: 04-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 1611
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| Posted: 04-Apr-2003 22:47 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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This possible Battletech movie might do a lot to help the game too. But in terms of making us happy, I think a serious attempt at a montly comic book stands a better chance of not turning out all screwed up than anything that Hollywood gets its hands on. A Btech movie might sell well, but the chances of it being faithful to the game and us Btech vets are not at all good. It would more likely be better for MW:DA than for Classic Btech while a comic book might be the other way around.
Remember the GI Joe comics, those sections in them where you got to see the layout of their secret base, details of their equipment, etc? A Battletech comic could be filled with such fluff stuff and that would lean it more toward Battletech instead of the extra-simple click-tech.
Anyone ever wanted to see a layout of the crew spaces of a Star Lord class jumpship? Or the interior of a Pegasus Scout Hover Tank? Or how about brief story/biographies of famouse Btech characters, or looks at noted MW and their mechs like in the old 3025 TRO book? A comic book could deliver stuff like that every month.
And as for branching into multiple storylines (more than 1 comic coming out per month), well hey there's 2750, 3025, 3050, Clan, Inner Sphere....
Of course just putting out a faithful and mod-able computer version of Btech so we can finally have regiment sized fights and who cares how many turns it takes since its all on the hard drive would make us even happier, but what are the odds of that happening?
[ This Message was edited by: Gunslinger Patch on 2003-04-04 22:50 ]
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Pinhead
The Bloody Clans
Joined: 25-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1258
Location: United States
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| Posted: 05-Apr-2003 14:55 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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You know? The worst thing I see in MW:DA is the desire to create a game which is not based on the workings of the past game.
I've been looking at it alot, and honestly? If you used the pieces they have put out, and modified the rules in a few spots, you actually end up with a very playable game which follows the roots of the original Battletech.
Honestly, I'd like to see a game which combines the roots of BTech with the minis of MW:DA.. I think not only would it be playable, but it would be fun.
Pin
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MEX
Clan Blood Spirit
Star Colonel
Joined: 21-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 440
Location: Austria
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| Posted: 05-Apr-2003 15:20 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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Quote:
| On 2003-04-05 14:55, Pinhead wrote:
Honestly, I'd like to see a game which combines the roots of BTech with the minis of MW:DA.. I think not only would it be playable, but it would be fun. |
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As soon as the CBT Record Sheets for the new MW:DA Mecha are available, everybody with a bit knowledge of mathematics wil be able to calculate values for the combat-dials for MW: DA figures of older BattleMechs.
Creating new stickers for the dials is easy, all you need to play older BattleMechs are some spare green figures from MW: DA.
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8052
Location: United States
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| Posted: 05-Apr-2003 19:27 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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On 2003-04-05 15:20, MEX wrote:
As soon as the CBT Record Sheets for the new MW:DA Mecha are available, everybody with a bit knowledge of mathematics wil be able to calculate values for the combat-dials for MW: DA figures of older BattleMechs.
Creating new stickers for the dials is easy, all you need to play older BattleMechs are some spare green figures from MW: DA.
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There is not a set mathamatical formula for the MWDA units--there is human intervention in every unit's stats.
Smart way to do that too
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MEX
Clan Blood Spirit
Star Colonel
Joined: 21-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 440
Location: Austria
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 00:39 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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Quote:
| On 2003-04-05 19:27, chihawk wrote:
There is not a set mathamatical formula for the MWDA units--there is human intervention in every unit's stats. |
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As soon as there are CBT-Recordsheets for MW: DA BattleMechs, you can set up equations with the weapons & stats for each BattleMech. From these equations you can extract the values for a single Weapon like a PPC, LRM, SRM or lasers and the type and amonth of armor. But you need university-level mathematic as this is beyond the level of mathematic most people are able to understand.
Of corse you wont get a simple formula into which you insert a old CBT-BattleMech and get the corresponding sticker for a MW: DA unit.
But the values you insert into the modified equations should allow you to create MW combat-dial-stickers for each old CBT BattleMech.
Similar had been done for the BT TradingCard Game from WotC to create cards for the unseen BattleMechs.
Just look at the CONVERSION RULES
at http://www.abo.fi/~jivars/bttcg/bttcg.htm
At http://members.aol.com/mschwaab/btechcrd.html you can even view scanned images of cards created with these rules !
I am sure that, as soon as there are CBT-recordsheets for the MW: DA BattleMechs, someone will do similar to create stickers for the combat dials of spare MW: DA figures.
MfG, MEX
[ This Message was edited by: MEX on 2003-04-06 00:54 ]
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8052
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 09:20 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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On 2003-04-06 00:39, MEX wrote:
But you need university-level mathematic as this is beyond the level of mathematic most people are able to understand.
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Which is why when Rick Raisley said there wasn't a mathamatical formula that fit the MWDA units I took his word for it. 
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MEX
Clan Blood Spirit
Star Colonel
Joined: 21-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 440
Location: Austria
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 09:32 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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Quote:
| On 2003-04-06 09:20, chihawk wrote:
Which is why when Rick Raisley said there wasn't a mathamatical formula that fit the MWDA units I took his word for it. |
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That why i said that you have to use mathematics
Of course there is no single formula. But with the equations you can set up between combat-dial-values & record-sheet-values, you can make tables for a simple conversion, like thouse which Gauss Bear has made for the BT TCG. Then everbody with a basic knowledge of mathematics should be able to use these tables.
MfG, MEX
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AlexxKnight
Federated Suns
Colonel
Joined: 11-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 787
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 14:44 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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New Maps, New Mpas, and More New Maps.
Hohiro had some good ideas: the outside of a dropship or warship hull, more island hopping maps, some new citytech maps of actual IS cities:new avalon, tharkad, solaris7, outreach, etc....
And Expanding on this idea, Map Sets for Actual planets, the Capital planets, and other majorly contested planets would be great.
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Command Company, Crimson Janissaries
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 20:31 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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Maybe working more on the roleplaying? Build up some more sourcebooks for that part of the game. It would allow those who cannot afford the miniature investment to get involved, then move into mechs as they gain buying power. All the maps could be put in there. The scale would be set up normally, but it would be easy to build a map from them for a scenario on the battlefield. If the Magnetic stickers on a mettal background idea is used you get a new marketing branch. The Avalon, Tharkad, Luthien etc. sticker sets for your base map. Contour lines would be marked with some sort of magnetic string or wire?
I always felt that the roleplay rules are too shallow even though mech battles are the main focus. Heck, for a while there were no grenade rules! How does infantry stand a chance with out some demolitions/ Grenades?
Roleplay should allow for game plot development into non-cannon areas. Some guidelines for how hard it would be to get the high(L3)tech, improve logistics, or getting your own factory, would be appropriate. Some of the stagnation is due to burn out on battling, better roleplay rules would keep the fans in the BT Universe, while allowing a change in pace.
The maps would help with the roleplaying and also gradually build up detail as to where things are. (where is the corean works in relation to avalon city? and such)
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[ This Message was edited by: Rarich on 2003-04-06 20:52 ]
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Kraken
Federated Suns
Marshal
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2755
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 20:51 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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Speaking of that,
Does anyone know when the MW3 Companion is due out? I've been too busy elsewhere to keep track of the release dates.
If I'm right, Rarich, since FanPro took direct fan requests for it that a lot of the problems with shallowness of the game and other things will be resolved somehow. We might even get a few MW sized maps out of it.
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Horhiro
Draconis Combine
Samurai
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1625
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 21:02 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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On 2003-04-04 21:14, Gangrene wrote:
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On 2003-04-04 20:26, Horhiro wrote:
What the game really needs to stay alive is CHEAP minis. Yes, that's what I said: CHEAP minis! Pre-painted plastic CBT minis a la Dark age, but on regular hex bases. Make them smaller if need be to keep the prices down.
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That certainly would help. I would buy minis if I didn't have to assemble and paint them.
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Oh, and I want them all painted by "Bombtech", not some overseas child laborors.....
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 21:10 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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That is one of the major problems with roleplay in the BT universe, MAPS. There were token efforts with the clans soucebooks, but still nothing like what was required. D&D at least got that part right.
Even on the large scale of which planets belong to who, things are messed up. directional relationships change too. Like where arenas are on solaris, in the book they are one way, in the original solaris package they are another. A set of maps should be worked up for capitols,and the Mech facility planets, and built up from there.
It would be good to iron out the details of prosthetic limbs too. How big a laser can fit into a forearm? Exactly how much is strength changed? to use examples from 2 novels. all these "little item" things that are not ironed out retract from the game. If you are going to put out warships, or Battle armor, you had better have some design rules. You know the first things the fans are going to do is design their own.
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Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side & a dark side, and strings also lie under it all.
Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1919
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| Posted: 06-Apr-2003 21:20 Post subject: RE: Btech stagnation |
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On 2003-04-06 20:51, Kraken wrote:
Speaking of that,
Does anyone know when the MW3 Companion is due out? I've been too busy elsewhere to keep track of the release dates.
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Peter said it should hit the stores this next week, I believe...there was a delay with the people who were to do the covers...
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If I'm right, Rarich, since FanPro took direct fan requests for it that a lot of the problems with shallowness of the game and other things will be resolved somehow. We might even get a few MW sized maps out of it.
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Well...we do have some fan input things going on right now over on the ClassicBattleTech message board...
Ruger
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