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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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 Posted: 16-Jul-2004 12:49 Post subject: RE: Torso destruction |
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"8. Weapons fire is resolved one unit at a time. As all combat is considered simultanious, the order of resolution does not matter. Note that players should resolve all the weapons attacks by one unit before begining those of any other unit.
9. Players determine damage from weapons attacks. Damage is recorded as attacks are resolved, but does not affect the unit until ALL weapons attacks bave been resolved. At that point, all damage takes effect immediately."
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The order of attacks does not matter in step 8. No damage is done during step 8 when hit locations are determined.
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The "order of attacks" refers to the order in which mechs shoot each other, not the order in which damage from individual weapons is taken into account. The latter obviously cannot be the case, because order matters in determining whether a chance for a crit has occurred or not. What the passage means is that if a mech is destroyed prior to its damage being recorded, the damage it inflicted is still done.
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Therefore, in step 8 when damage locations are determined, the arm is still a viable target area until step nine, when it is destroyed by the damage which takes effect immediately. |
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It does not say damage locations are determined in step 8, it says "fire is resolved" i.e. the to-hits are rolled. Hit location is determined in step 9.
You are taking the statements out of context. Also, maybe you should use the BMR, not a manual from 1987 which contains obscure language.
You are losing sight of the whole issue. Yes, the manual says "simultaneous". It also says that effects from damage are "immediate." The issue is which do players give priority to, since they are in direct conflict. You can quote passages that say "simultaneous" all day but that does not address the problem.
[ This Message was edited by: Gangrene on 2004-07-16 12:51 ]
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Gangrene
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Oafman
Draconis Combine
Tai-sho
Joined: 18-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 1657
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Jul-2004 14:04 Post subject: RE: Torso destruction |
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Yes to which question? You cannot answer yes to both questions.
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Festina Lente!
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Jul-2004 14:16 Post subject: RE: Torso destruction |
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On 2004-07-16 14:04, Oafman wrote:
Yes to which question? You cannot answer yes to both questions.
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Those questions are not mutually exclusive. The second is an extension of the first. My answer is yes.
[ This Message was edited by: Gangrene on 2004-07-16 14:17 ]
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Gangrene
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Mordel
Mordel.Net
Administrator
Joined: 03-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 6036
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Jul-2004 15:46 Post subject: RE: Torso destruction |
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On 2004-07-16 12:39, Gangrene wrote:
Yes.
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Well, all I can say is while I disagree with you, at least you are consistent in the manner in which you play, and with that I have no problems.
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Mordel Blacknight - Site Administrator
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SaberDance
Federated Suns
Colonel
Joined: 07-May-2004 00:00
Posts: 837
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| Posted: 17-Jul-2004 00:06 Post subject: RE: Torso destruction |
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On 2004-07-16 12:49, Gangrene wrote:
The "order of attacks" refers to the order in which mechs shoot each other, not the order in which damage from individual weapons is taken into account. The latter obviously cannot be the case, because order matters in determining whether a chance for a crit has occurred or not. What the passage means is that if a mech is destroyed prior to its damage being recorded, the damage it inflicted is still done.
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Therefore, in step 8 when damage locations are determined, the arm is still a viable target area until step nine, when it is destroyed by the damage which takes effect immediately. |
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It does not say damage locations are determined in step 8, it says "fire is resolved" i.e. the to-hits are rolled. Hit location is determined in step 9.
You are taking the statements out of context. Also, maybe you should use the BMR, not a manual from 1987 which contains obscure language.
You are losing sight of the whole issue. Yes, the manual says "simultaneous". It also says that effects from damage are "immediate." The issue is which do players give priority to, since they are in direct conflict. You can quote passages that say "simultaneous" all day but that does not address the problem.
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3 points:
1.) The purpose of stating the book and page number of the quote was to establish that I was not taking the rules out of context, but was in fact aware of their greater positioning. I didn't feel like writing all 11 steps on the board.
2.) Hit locations are determined in step 8. Reference step nine, "damage is recorded as weapons attacks are resolved." Weapons fire is resolved in step 8, that requires determining hit location in step 8. Damage takes effect immediately in step 9, but hit location is determined in step 8.
3.) Obscure language is always good in rules, it lends them flexibility, but these aren't that obscure. And another thing, this is classic battletech, and I'll wager that my 1987 Battletech manual trumps your BMR in that category.
Humble opinion only. Just happens to be right.
Matt "SaberDance" Howell
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"Politics is the Art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, misdiagnosing the problem, and applying the wrong solution."
-Groucho Marx
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