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Fang
Federated Suns
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Joined: 11-Sep-2006 00:00
Posts: 290
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PostPosted: 26-Jun-2008 19:39    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Hello good gentle people of mordels and fellow battletech players and fans. I have a dilema, and the last time I had a dilema of this sort, it was the fine folks in these forums who helped out wonderfully. Here is how it is. I am writing some background and extended fiction for Ground Zero and the Stonkin family as well as their involvement with the rogue pirate army called the horde(first mentioned in the fluff for my Alpharus assault mech). Part of this involves using elements in Battlespace and Aerospace( jumpships, warships, dropships, and fighters).My knowledge of this part of the cbt universe is terribly limited. I have about nine of the specialized drop ships euipped to transport up to six mechs/ vehicles and fighter support at a time lined up in the story, some carrying battlemechs and fighter support, and a few with nothing but supplies and additional fighters(ammo, parts,medical units and such). I have no idea of what kind and size of jumpship or possible jumpships would be needed to transport this force to where it is going. Along the way they get caught and temporarily held by FWL forces while the jumpships are recharging. This is the point wher I really get stymied. I want to be able to utilize either an enormous Star League warship design, or have a unique custom design enter the scene. I have no knowledge or experience in creating warship designs. The vessel would need to be enourmous with massive firepower, travel great distances inbetween recharging(if warships do indeed need to recharge like jumpships. Or are they also transported along like dropships. I have no idea.), and be able to carry a large flotilla of fighter support. Is this even possible under current design restrictions? C-bill/H-bill cost is not a factor, as this is to be a one of a kind and NOT for general production war machine.The basic background for the vessel is that it was originally designed and thought to not have been built during the heyday of the star league. Truth be told actually one was built but the cost was so enormous the design was dropped. The completely stocked and fully armed vessel was lost on a jump, and not recouvered until around 3057 be the descendant of a memeber of the original design team. It does not have to be too practical as it is largely intended for the story line and not for game use.But I do have this thing where I like for anything I put in my fluff/writing to be able to be used byother players in their campaigns if they find it interesting. The vessel wold need to be able to stand up to other warships on an even keel, say other battleships/dreadnoughts(once again, I have no idea if they are designated as such) and be able to snap the spine of smaller vessels. Well, I have taken up enough of your time for now, so PLEASE, respond with any ideas, suggeestions, or evn designs. And remember, it could be a flyig tincan, but if you call it a warship, I probably wouldn't know the difference. Smile

*also, I plan to spell check anything I post here in the future. gees, I need a good dictionary.*
* Full credit will be given the creatorsof any unique designs and customized vessels *
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ralgith
Blighted Sun Battalion
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PostPosted: 27-Jun-2008 01:54    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

A) Warships are basically armored and armed jumpships with smaller jump cores. They can still only jump up to 30 light years at a time. They can be equipped with lithium fusion batteries... allowing a second FTL jump, of again up to 30 light years.

B) I have posted a couple designs here... but since they have all been incorporated into MY fiction... I can design something specific for you and post it tomorrow or the day after. Of course I'm sure many others will jump on this too Wink

C) All Warships carry SOME fighter launch capability.

D) Questions:
Do you want it to carry all of your dropships? This is need to know, as I need to know how many docking collars to give it. Normally I would give a battleship a minimum of 5, with no maximum as long as it is reasonable.

How much fighter capacity are you looking for here? Are we talking a Battleship, or a Carrier, or a BattleCarrier, or a Heavy Battle Cruiser or what?
BattleShip: lower fighter support, a lot of big guns
Carrier: An enormous fighter capacity but far less effective at naval fire
BattleCarrier: a hybrid of the two but leaning closer to BattleShip
Heavy Battle Cruiser: Lower weight than a battleship, but better speed and maneuverability... can do a BattleCarrier of this as well...

Do you want a detachable recharge sail?

There are other things, but for now I'm too tired to think.
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Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company 'Ralgith's Renegades'

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ralgith
Blighted Sun Battalion
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PostPosted: 27-Jun-2008 02:45    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Scratch that... I decided to come up with a design that answers all my questions the way I think they should be answered Razz

NOTES: Design is level 3 because I break launch door rules only. Dumb rule and very impractical. Boobies.

This is lighter than the McKenna, and outguns and outclasses it by a lot... Carries 40 AeroSpace Fighters, some small craft... and even has pressurized repair facilities Smile Who knew?! Clown Full life pod capacity, 10 docking rings, 6 grav decks (in counter rotating pairs)

Now, the downside... It is somewhat lacking in point defense weaponry. Yet still possesses enough that it should be able to swat most fighters like flies. Or so I think anyways.

So, without further ado here is the currently fluffless Avatar of Hell's fury class BattleShip Hamer of Light.. (I named this ship Hammer of Light since I assumed thats what your topic titles was about)

Code:
                    AeroTech 2 Vessel Technical Readout
                                  VALIDATED

Class/Model/Name:  Avatar of Hell's Fury Hammer of Light
Tech:              Inner Sphere / 2750
Vessel Type:       WarShip
Rules:             Level 3, Custom design
Rules Set:         AeroTech2

Mass:              1,750,000 tons
K-F Drive System:  (Unknown)
Length:            1,295 meters
Sail Diameter:     1,473 meters
Power Plant:       Standard
Safe Thrust:       4
Maximum Thrust:    6
Armor Type:        Lamellor Ferro-carbide
Armament:         
    4 NL55
   24 Heavy NPPC
   80 ER Large Laser
   32 LB 10-X AC
    5 NAC/40
    4 NAC/30
    4 AR10 Launcher
   14 Heavy N-Gauss
    2 Medium NPPC
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Class/Model/Name:  Avatar of Hell's Fury Hammer of Light
Mass:              1,750,000 tons

Equipment:                                                            Mass 
Power Plant, Drive & Control:                                      420,000.00
Thrust:  Safe Thrust: 4
      Maximum Thrust: 6
Kearny-Fuchida Hyperdrive:  Compact (Integrity = 34)               791,875.00
Lithium Fusion Battery                                              17,500.00
Jump Sail (Detachable): (Integrity = 7)                                118.00
Structural Integrity: 75                                           131,250.00
Total Heat Sinks:    5,000 Double                                    4,039.00
Fuel & Fuel Pumps:                                                  17,850.00
Bridge, Controls, Radar, Computer & Attitude Thrusters:              4,375.00
Fire Control Computers:                                             19,820.00
Food & Water:  (481 days supply)                                     2,250.00
Hyperpulse Generator:                                                   50.00
Armor Type:  Lamellor Ferro-carbide  (2,673 total armor pts)         2,625.00
                           Capital Scale Armor Pts
   Location:                            L / R
   Fore:                                492
   Fore-Left/Right:                  445/445
   Aft-Left/Right:                   445/445
   Aft:                                 401

Cargo:
   Bay 1:  Fighters (20) with 4 doors                                3,000.00
           Small Craft (2) with 1 door                                 400.00
   Bay 2:  Fighters (20) with 4 doors                                3,000.00
           Small Craft (2) with 1 door                                 400.00
   Bay 3:  Cargo (1) with 10 doors                                   5,000.00
   Bay 4:  Press Repair Facil. (13-100 T Capy)                         104.00

DropShip Capacity:  10 Docking Hardpoints                           10,000.00
Grav Decks #1 - 2:  (90-meter diameter)                                100.00
Grav Decks #3 - 4:  (80-meter diameter)                                100.00
Grav Decks #5 - 6:  (90-meter diameter)                                100.00
Life Boats:  100 (7 tons each)                                         700.00
Escape Pods:  100 (7 tons each)                                        700.00

Crew and Passengers:
    100 Officers (90 minimum)                                        1,000.00
    350 Crew (295 minimum)                                           2,450.00
    100 Gunners (76 minimum)                                           700.00
    250 Marines                                                      1,250.00
     36 Marine Battle Armor Troopers/Elementals                        252.00
    100 Bay Personnel                                                     .00
Weapons and Equipment      Loc        SRV    MRV    LRV    ERV  Heat    Mass
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 NL55                     Nose        11     11     11     11  170  2,200.00
4 Heavy NPPC               Nose        60     60     60     60  900 12,000.00
5 ER Large Laser           Nose     4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --   60     25.00
5 ER Large Laser           Nose     4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --   60     25.00
2 LB 10-X AC(50 rounds)    Nose     1(12)  1(12)     --     --    4     27.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    Nose     1(12)  1(12)     --     --    4     24.00
1 NAC/40(25 rounds)        Nose        40     40     --     --  135  4,530.00
4 Heavy NPPC               FL/R        60     60     60     60 1800 24,000.00
2 NAC/30(50 rounds)        FL/R        60     60     60     --  400 14,080.00
2 AR10 (20 KW, 20 WS, 20 B)FL/R         *      *      *      *   80  5,800.00
2 Heavy N-Gauss(50 rounds) FL/R        60     60     60     60   72 28,050.00
5 ER Large Laser           FL/R     4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --  120     50.00
5 ER Large Laser           FL/R     4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --  120     50.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    FL/R     1(12)  1(12)     --     --    8     48.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    FL/R     1(12)  1(12)     --     --    8     48.00
1 Heavy N-Gauss(25 rounds) FL/R        30     30     30     30   36 14,026.00
4 Heavy NPPC               L/RBS       60     60     60     60 1800 24,000.00
1 NAC/40(25 rounds)        L/RBS       40     40     --     --  270  9,060.00
1 NAC/40(25 rounds)        L/RBS       40     40     --     --  270  9,060.00
2 Heavy N-Gauss(50 rounds) L/RBS       60     60     60     60   72 28,050.00
5 ER Large Laser           L/RBS    4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --  120     50.00
5 ER Large Laser           L/RBS    4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --  120     50.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    L/RBS    1(12)  1(12)     --     --    8     48.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    L/RBS    1(12)  1(12)     --     --    8     48.00
2 Heavy N-Gauss(50 rounds) L/RBS       60     60     60     60   72 28,050.00
2 Heavy NPPC               AL/R        30     30     30     30  900 12,000.00
5 ER Large Laser           AL/R     4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --  120     50.00
5 ER Large Laser           AL/R     4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --  120     50.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    AL/R     1(12)  1(12)     --     --    8     48.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    AL/R     1(12)  1(12)     --     --    8     48.00
2 NL55                     Aft         11     11     11     11  170  2,200.00
2 Medium NPPC              Aft         18     18     18     18  270  3,600.00
5 ER Large Laser           Aft      4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --   60     25.00
5 ER Large Laser           Aft      4(40)  4(40)  4(40)     --   60     25.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    Aft      1(12)  1(12)     --     --    4     24.00
2 LB 10-X AC(20 rounds)    Aft      1(12)  1(12)     --     --    4     24.00
1 Lot Spare Parts (5.00%)                                           87,500.00
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS:                                            Heat: 8,441   1,750,000.00
Tons Left:                                                                .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost:        34,276,172,000 C-Bills
Battle Value:      291,682
Cost per BV:       117,512.13
Weapon Value:      165,695 (Ratio = .57)
Damage Factors:    SRV = 11,359;  MRV = 11,198;  LRV = 8,527;  ERV = 2,752
Maintenance:       Maintenance Point Value (MPV) = 1,049,729
                   (150,280 Structure, 545,988 Life Support, 353,461 Weapons)

                   Support Points (SP) = 647,100  (62% of MPV)
BattleForce2:      Not applicable



Avatar of Hell's Fury Hammer of Light.hma
 Description: Copy of the Heavy Metal Aero file.

Avatar of Hell's Fury class Battleship
Hammer of Light 

Download
 Filename: Avatar of Hell's Fury Hammer of Light.hma 
 Filesize: 2.59 KB 
 Downloaded: 454 Time(s) 

_________________
Colonel Ralgith t'Mayasara
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company 'Ralgith's Renegades'

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Vagabond
Mercenary
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Mr. Referee


Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5791
Location: United States
PostPosted: 27-Jun-2008 17:06    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Code:
                    AeroTech 2 Vessel Technical Readout
                                  VALIDATED

Class/Model/Name:  Hammer of Light Armored Cruiser
Tech:              Inner Sphere / 2750
Vessel Type:       WarShip
Rules:             Level 2, Custom design
Rules Set:         AeroTech2

Mass:              1,000,000 tons
K-F Drive System:  (Unknown)
Length:            905 meters
Sail Diameter:     1,206 meters
Power Plant:       Standard
Safe Thrust:       4
Maximum Thrust:    6
Armor Type:        Lamellor Ferro-carbide
Armament:         
   14 NAC/40
   16 ER PPC
   16 Large Pulse Laser
   16 Gauss Rifle
   24 AMS
   16 Heavy NPPC
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Class/Model/Name:  Hammer of Light
Mass:              1,000,000 tons

Equipment:                                                            Mass 
Power Plant, Drive & Control:                                      240,000.00
Thrust:  Safe Thrust: 4
      Maximum Thrust: 6
Kearny-Fuchida Hyperdrive:  Compact (Integrity = 20)               452,500.00
Lithium Fusion Battery                                              10,000.00
Jump Sail (Detachable): (Integrity = 5)                                 80.00
Structural Integrity: 117                                          117,000.00
Total Heat Sinks:    2,965 Double                                    2,228.00
Fuel & Fuel Pumps:                                                   7,378.00
Bridge, Controls, Radar, Computer & Attitude Thrusters:              2,500.00
Fire Control Computers:                                                   .00
Food & Water:  (366 days supply)                                     1,476.00
Hyperpulse Generator:                                                   50.00
Armor Type:  Lamellor Ferro-carbide  (2,412 total armor pts)         2,340.00
                           Capital Scale Armor Pts
   Location:                            L / R
   Fore:                                404
   Fore-Left/Right:                  404/404
   Aft-Left/Right:                   400/400
   Aft:                                 400

Cargo:
   Bay 1:  Fighters (6) with 2 doors                                   900.00
           Cargo (1) with 1 door                                     1,200.00
   Bay 2:  Fighters (6) with 2 doors                                   900.00
           Cargo (1) with 1 door                                     1,200.00
   Bay 3:  Fighters (6) with 2 doors                                   900.00
           Cargo (1) with 1 door                                     1,200.00
   Bay 4:  Small Craft (8) with 2 doors                              1,600.00
           Cargo (1) with 1 door                                     1,600.00
   Bay 5:  Cargo (1) with 3 doors                                    4,625.00
   Bay 6:  Cargo (1) with 3 doors                                    4,625.00

DropShip Capacity:  6 Docking Hardpoints                             6,000.00
Grav Decks #1 - 6:  (150-meter diameter)                               600.00
Escape Pods:  104 (7 tons each)                                        728.00

Crew and Passengers:
    100 Officers (96 minimum)                                        1,000.00
    400 Crew (145 minimum)                                           2,800.00
     84 Gunners (42 minimum)                                           588.00
     24 1st Class Passengers                                           240.00
     48 2nd Class Passengers                                           336.00
     74 Marines                                                        370.00
     76 Bay Personnel                                                     .00
Weapons and Equipment      Loc        SRV    MRV    LRV    ERV  Heat    Mass
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        Nose        40     40     --     --  135  4,600.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        Nose        40     40     --     --  135  4,600.00
2 ER PPC                   Nose     2(20)  2(20)  2(20)     --   30     14.00
2 ER PPC                   Nose     2(20)  2(20)  2(20)     --   30     14.00
2 Large Pulse Laser        Nose     2(18)  2(18)     --     --   20     14.00
2 Large Pulse Laser        Nose     2(18)  2(18)     --     --   20     14.00
2 Gauss Rifle(80 rounds)   Nose     3(30)  3(30)  3(30)     --    2     40.00
2 Gauss Rifle(80 rounds)   Nose     3(30)  3(30)  3(30)     --    2     40.00
3 AMS(120 rounds)          Nose        --     --     --     --    3     11.50
3 AMS(120 rounds)          Nose        --     --     --     --    3     11.50
4 Heavy NPPC               FL/R        60     60     60     60 1800 24,000.00
4 Heavy NPPC               FL/R        60     60     60     60 1800 24,000.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        FL/R        40     40     --     --  270  9,200.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        FL/R        40     40     --     --  270  9,200.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        FL/R        40     40     --     --  270  9,200.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        L/RBS       40     40     --     --  270  9,200.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        L/RBS       40     40     --     --  270  9,200.00
2 ER PPC                   L/RBS    2(20)  2(20)  2(20)     --   60     28.00
2 ER PPC                   L/RBS    2(20)  2(20)  2(20)     --   60     28.00
2 Large Pulse Laser        L/RBS    2(18)  2(18)     --     --   40     28.00
2 Large Pulse Laser        L/RBS    2(18)  2(18)     --     --   40     28.00
2 Gauss Rifle(80 rounds)   L/RBS    3(30)  3(30)  3(30)     --    4     80.00
2 Gauss Rifle(80 rounds)   L/RBS    3(30)  3(30)  3(30)     --    4     80.00
3 AMS(120 rounds)          L/RBS       --     --     --     --    6     23.00
3 AMS(120 rounds)          L/RBS       --     --     --     --    6     23.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        Aft         40     40     --     --  135  4,600.00
1 NAC/40(83 rounds)        Aft         40     40     --     --  135  4,600.00
2 ER PPC                   Aft      2(20)  2(20)  2(20)     --   30     14.00
2 ER PPC                   Aft      2(20)  2(20)  2(20)     --   30     14.00
2 Large Pulse Laser        Aft      2(18)  2(18)     --     --   20     14.00
2 Large Pulse Laser        Aft      2(18)  2(18)     --     --   20     14.00
2 Gauss Rifle(80 rounds)   Aft      3(30)  3(30)  3(30)     --    2     40.00
2 Gauss Rifle(80 rounds)   Aft      3(30)  3(30)  3(30)     --    2     40.00
3 AMS(120 rounds)          Aft         --     --     --     --    3     11.50
3 AMS(120 rounds)          Aft         --     --     --     --    3     11.50
1 Lot Spare Parts (2.00%)                                           20,000.00
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS:                                            Heat: 5,930   1,000,000.00
Tons Left:                                                                .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost:        23,015,015,064 C-Bills
Battle Value:      207,108
Cost per BV:       111,125.67
Weapon Value:      126,012 (Ratio = .61)
Damage Factors:    SRV = 7,910;  MRV = 7,754;  LRV = 5,889;  ERV = 694
Maintenance:       Maintenance Point Value (MPV) = 647,722
                   (133,684 Structure, 325,550 Life Support, 188,488 Weapons)
                   Support Points (SP) = 673,892  (104% of MPV)
BattleForce2:      Not applicable


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Fang
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PostPosted: 27-Jun-2008 21:41    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

WoW! You guys rock! Had in mind a fully laden fairly unarmed jumpship at a pirate jumppoint coming in to recharge, two small(well, small for a warship anyway) FWL warships are coasting in to investigate and flank the jumpshp, one on either side.Then the Hammer of Light silently ( well, its space. everything is silent. Duh, Vacuum?) glides in. Fighters are deployed and assault dropships begin to detach from the docking rings. The FWL captains are at a momentary loss of words at the descending unknown vessel. Would I need to use naval terminology in reference to a space battle?
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PostPosted: 27-Jun-2008 23:25    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

You probably should... yes... if you have questions PM me and I'll sort you out mate Wink

Just like old times LOL

So, which ship are you going to use?

Its funny because Vagabond and I are 2 of the top 3 ship designers here... so I'm asking out of competitive spirit Very Happy
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PostPosted: 27-Jun-2008 23:37    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Sweet! I will do so. I think I may actually use both if that is OK. After a brief battle leaving one of the FWL warships a scorched flickering hulk and the other damaged, the second Hammer of Light slides into view. I am thinking of somehow perhaps working the Stars End pirates into the fluff as a place for possible repair/refit/maintenance away from prying eyes.No, the pirates do not have control of the vessels. Not sure about how to sort that all out yet, as I am not really aware of anywhere else that could be used without drawing a lot of unwanted attention. And I am certain that Ground Zero and Stonkin Mechs do NOT have the needed facilities laying around.
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 04:12    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Well, you can look for naval battle in Kerensky and Kurita and if you can get your hands on AT2 (or better Battlespace...)
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 05:30    Post subject: Re: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Fang wrote:
Sweet! I will do so. I think I may actually use both if that is OK. After a brief battle leaving one of the FWL warships a scorched flickering hulk and the other damaged, the second Hammer of Light slides into view. I am thinking of somehow perhaps working the Stars End pirates into the fluff as a place for possible repair/refit/maintenance away from prying eyes.No, the pirates do not have control of the vessels. Not sure about how to sort that all out yet, as I am not really aware of anywhere else that could be used without drawing a lot of unwanted attention. And I am certain that Ground Zero and Stonkin Mechs do NOT have the needed facilities laying around.


As in Vagabond's lighter vessel being the Hammer of Light and the one I made being the Hammer of Light II or something? You'll need a way to justify 2 entirely different classes of ship. A different name for one of them would be good too.

As for where to base them (or repair them) you can always make something up. For instance you "find" (in their ships databases maybe) an ancient Star League drydoock facility in the Altaraan Nebula or something like that. Make it up, but keep it within reason.
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 05:32    Post subject: Re: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Sleeping Dragon wrote:
Well, you can look for naval battle in Kerensky and Kurita and if you can get your hands on AT2 (or better Battlespace...)


Or get his hands on the novels in the Twilight of the Clans series. The space battles between the Task Force Serpent fleet and the Ghost Bear and Smoke Jaguar ships are well written. I love Commodore Beresick and The Invisible Truth.
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 11:09    Post subject: Re: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

What about this. The PPC and Laser laden design is the Hammer of Light, and the other is Hammer of Mercy.
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 11:57    Post subject: Re: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Heheh, do you mean normal PPC and Laser? Or Naval Weapons? Cause Vagabond and I both used quite a few Naval PPCs

I love the things Very Happy

Anyways, just curious now so I can edit my file accordingly and change the ship's name if need be.
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 14:39    Post subject: Re: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

ralgith wrote:
Heheh, do you mean normal PPC and Laser? Or Naval Weapons? Cause Vagabond and I both used quite a few Naval PPCs

I love the things Very Happy

Anyways, just curious now so I can edit my file accordingly and change the ship's name if need be.


Plus mine has lots of standard PPCs and Lasers while yours has more NPPCs and NLasers. lol.

My vessel is more of an Armored Escort for a 'Mech battalion with attached Aero support. If you use the right dropships even a Regiment or small RTC with attached Logistical support.

The big guns will deter assault dropships and light cruiser and below warships [canon only mostly] while the cargo, 3 flight decks, and armor give it duration in the field. It also has effective AA screen.
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 17:22    Post subject: Re: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Oops. I should have been more specific. Ralgith's design is Hammer of Light, and Vagabond's will be Hammer of Mercy.
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PostPosted: 28-Jun-2008 20:15    Post subject: Hammer of Light Reply to topic Reply with quote

Oh i see, sure.... choose the battleship over the armored cruiser. I see how it is, humph. lol.
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