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DarkAdder
Clan Star Adder
Star Commander
Joined: 10-Jan-2004 00:00
Posts: 604
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 Posted: 30-Nov-2005 01:09 Post subject: Pirate points |
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Im trying to figure out how to calculate pirate points. I only have the BattleSpace rules, and those have the tables for standard jump points, but nothing for pirate points, that I can see. Ive also been through my Explorer Corps handbook, with similar results.
Im working on something for a BattleTech campaign, and kind of need to know this stuff. Does anyone know how to figure the distance to pirate points, hours, days, etc?
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Rudel Gurken
Allisters Light Thunder
Major
Joined: 15-Jun-2005 00:00
Posts: 1463
Location: Germany
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 01:50 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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Most ships use zenit/nadir jumppoints because the gravitational effects are always low on this spots.
Piratpoints are points more within the system on that the gravitational effects single each other out. Its very difficult for a navigator to calculate such a point because it depends on the position of each planetary body!
Good knowledge about the systems planets is essential! The older the information is the higher is the risk of jumping off-point and damaging the KF-Drive!
But on the other side this points can be considerably closer to the planet!
(I think as close as 1/5 of the standard trip)
As a gamemaster you have no chance to calculate such a pirate-point: simply guess or put it where you need it! 
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5785
Location: United States
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 01:52 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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On 2005-11-30 01:09, DarkAdder wrote:
Im trying to figure out how to calculate pirate points. I only have the BattleSpace rules, and those have the tables for standard jump points, but nothing for pirate points, that I can see. Ive also been through my Explorer Corps handbook, with similar results.
Im working on something for a BattleTech campaign, and kind of need to know this stuff. Does anyone know how to figure the distance to pirate points, hours, days, etc?
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To my knowledge, they can be anywhere in the system were gravitational forces are near 0. A point could theoreticaly exist between say the earth and the moon at just the point were they cancel each other and other wells out.
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 03:16 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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According to the picture and text in Battlespace and Aerospace 2 there is safe distance from the star, sphere where gravitational forces are not dangerous anymore. both zenith and nadir are sitting in this distance, otherwise it's possible to arrive anywhere beyond this sphere. Pirate points are located on that safety limit sphere's surface too, but additional calculations are made to bring you close to target planet. Points in this sphere are probably LaGrange points. There is nothing about calculating the travel distance from pirate points to planet, but as example there is Luthien (8 days standard, 11 hours pirate). Before jump calculations are three times as long for pirate points and you must have working computer to execute them.
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Nightmare
Lyran Alliance
Kommandant-General
Joined: 03-May-2002 00:00
Posts: 2214
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 08:39 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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And don't forget that you really risk damage to your ship by using pirate points!
There's so much you need to know. People in civilized systems may well be dumping things like space stations in the stable points just because they're stable. Is a few days off transit worth risking a multi-billion C-bill Jumpship?
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ralgith
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company
"Ralgith's Renegades"
Colonel
Joined: 18-Aug-2003 00:00
Posts: 2021
Location: United States
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 10:33 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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A JumpShip's jump sensors detect objects and adjust point of entry, how do you think they safely jump into a standard point when they don't know what other ships are sitting there?
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Colonel Ralgith t'Mayasara
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company 'Ralgith's Renegades'
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Warhammer: 3025
Freelance
Captain, AFFC (Ret.)
Joined: 29-Jan-2005 00:00
Posts: 1856
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 11:03 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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Quote:
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On 2005-11-30 10:33, ralgith wrote:
A JumpShip's jump sensors detect objects and adjust point of entry, how do you think they safely jump into a standard point when they don't know what other ships are sitting there?
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hehe. This is a topic we were covering a little while ago at the HeavyMetal forums.
Here.
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 13:55 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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And those from less civilized worlds may dump trash there? 
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Seraph
Blighted Sun Battalion
2nd Company
"Seraph's Slaughter"
Major
Joined: 11-Mar-2004 00:00
Posts: 1744
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 18:41 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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Aye, but how big of an object is registered by said sensors? All you need is an object the size of a pea to cause a really big problem.
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Seraph
Blighted Sun Battalion
2nd Company
"Seraph's Slaughter"
Major
Joined: 11-Mar-2004 00:00
Posts: 1744
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 18:43 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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I would make up a table where you could roll a die or dice to come up with a random length of time. Either make one for each system based off the normal transit time or make a generic one that uses percentages instead of days/hours.
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DarkAdder
Clan Star Adder
Star Commander
Joined: 10-Jan-2004 00:00
Posts: 604
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| Posted: 30-Nov-2005 20:07 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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Well, Im wondering because I need it for my MW campaign. My players have taken on a mission doing garrison duty on a planet on the boarder of the Smoke Jag Occupation zone (circa 3054). They are going to take a few raids for a while, but then Im looking to drop a planetary assault on them, with the Jags using a pirate point to enter the system.
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Nightmare
Lyran Alliance
Kommandant-General
Joined: 03-May-2002 00:00
Posts: 2214
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| Posted: 01-Dec-2005 00:59 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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Quote:
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On 2005-11-30 10:33, ralgith wrote:
A JumpShip's jump sensors detect objects and adjust point of entry, how do you think they safely jump into a standard point when they don't know what other ships are sitting there?
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Safe holding zones? Rotating time tables? But seriously, I didn't mean that the ship would materialize inside another one. Just that appearing near to something might cause a hazard.
Those sensors wouldn't be the same that allow a jumpship to damage nearby objects by jumping out when there's stuff too close? Seems they don't actually work too well. 
Anyway, using pirate points is very risky so the reward had better be big. Eleven hours to Luthien sounds good, but your jumpship will need over 180 hours to safely charge up. I imagine the DCMS will destroy or capture it long before that.
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 01-Dec-2005 16:29 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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Maybe just guessing how long will it take for them to prepare for defense and give them a little less time would be the best way to go.
"Commander we picked up signal..." "What kind of signal" "Jump shock wave, coordinates ..., they came from outer edge of system" "Ship profiles, and how long in the hell are they here?" "Probably raiding party, Broad sword and some spheroid, maybe Sassanid. We picked up signal from station on third moon two hours ago, but weather blocked signal, we have some eight hours... "
Smoke Jags raiding party would probably attempt hot drop on objective 
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ralgith
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company
"Ralgith's Renegades"
Colonel
Joined: 18-Aug-2003 00:00
Posts: 2021
Location: United States
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| Posted: 02-Dec-2005 02:02 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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On 2005-11-30 18:41, Seraph wrote:
Aye, but how big of an object is registered by said sensors? All you need is an object the size of a pea to cause a really big problem.
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Agreed, all it takes is something the size of a needle moving at a couple hundred kph to penetrate your unarmored hull 
Just guessing, I would say they could detect things down to maybe basketball in size... since they would be calibrated to detect small meteors and comets and other such astronomic phenomena. But again, thats just a guess 
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Colonel Ralgith t'Mayasara
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company 'Ralgith's Renegades'
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ralgith
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company
"Ralgith's Renegades"
Colonel
Joined: 18-Aug-2003 00:00
Posts: 2021
Location: United States
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| Posted: 02-Dec-2005 02:02 Post subject: RE: Pirate points |
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Quote:
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On 2005-11-30 13:55, Sleeping Dragon wrote:
And those from less civilized worlds may dump trash there?
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Aye, remember standard Imperial procedure is to dump their garbage.... oh wait... this isn't Star Wars
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Colonel Ralgith t'Mayasara
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company 'Ralgith's Renegades'
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