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AWAD
Draconis Combine
Chu-sa
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 766
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 Posted: 14-Jan-2003 12:30 Post subject: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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Most competent gamers always save their SRMs for last, looking for that Critical Hit in exposed spaces. But I have never seen a system for the long range stuff.
When I say laser, I am talking long range stuff like LL and PPC. What is the best way, scrub away some armor and then punch through with lasers or try and make some holes and then add on some pain.
Some Mechs have the ability themselves, Stalker and Kurita version Archer. So this is an even more critical question. Especially when heat is involved. But think about lance situations, which Mech fires first? The missile carrier or the laser boat? (at the same target)
I think I have framed the question well enough. As for me I like to lay down with missiles first. Even scrubbing of armor makes it easier to punch through later. This is really important in the medium weight class as 12-18 points of armor are very common on many locations. In the long run I am dumping ammo before it goes boom. So if I have a choice, of more LRM fire vs. Laser fire, before it becomes a melee, LRMs away.
Of course this is all in basic theory, once ECM, terrain, and other items get involved, the toggle switch on the trigger may change.
AWAD- Kurita Archer just rocks… And gets damn hot
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Nightmare
Lyran Alliance
Kommandant-General
Joined: 03-May-2002 00:00
Posts: 2214
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 12:43 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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I usually go with biggest guns first, if only because that gives the smaller ones more chances at criticals. Not that I think it really matters that much.
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Jade_Dragon
8th Sword of Light
Sho-sho
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1326
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 12:59 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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In the perfect world one a single turn I always fire the weapons with the bigest damage to one hit location first, that pretty much means that LRMs are the last weapon I fire before the SRMs. However, that is in the perfect world where I have enough heat sinks to fire everything, and the to hit numbers are all the same, etc.
Now if I have a choice between firing two different weapons systems, like say on the Stalker. I say go with whatever has the best to-hit chance and the best damage potential next. So with the Stalker with targets in medium to long range that would equal probably one LL and two LRM 10s.
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 13:14 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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I always prefer laser, and then more laser. Unless you're using special munitions LRM's suck.
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Gangrene
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Jade_Dragon
8th Sword of Light
Sho-sho
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1326
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 14:24 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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Every see what 350 LRMs do to a target when they hit?
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8081
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 15:19 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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And how often do you have 350 LRMs to hit?
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Jade_Dragon
8th Sword of Light
Sho-sho
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1326
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 16:33 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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Depends on your unit makeup and battle size. But even if only a third of the 350 hit the emeny mech goes down hard.
Standard LRMs can be very effective if used properly. Ihave fought battles before where my opponent left my Archer on the hill above the battle alone and let it rain salvo after salvo of LRM 20s on the battle below.
I played in another battle where a heavy LRM equiped lance was pinned between two enemy lances on a 2x2 map. Lance one close faily quickly but one of the Archers got lucky and stove in the Battlemaster head with physical attacks. Repeated LRM salvos trashed a Marauder. Lance one backed off and tried to hit my linek up with lance 2 so I turned around and pounded Lance 2 as they attempted to take out the objective. Last but not least I finished off lance 1 as they tried to back off their linking maneuver. First time that I every ran and Archer out of ammo.
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The Ice Hellion Roars
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[ This Message was edited by: Jade_Dragon on 2003-01-14 16:33 ]
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8081
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 16:40 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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I'm guessing the average to-hit for IS LRMs is probably around 10--figure a 4 gunner at medium range plus both attacker and target movement, along with intervening terrain.
Now you have to roll on the missile chart so on average only half of the missiles that hit actually do damage.
LRMs are essentially useless in most games...
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GeoAvanti
Federated Suns
Sergeant-Major
Joined: 07-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 126
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 17:04 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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I always use LRMs first (If I even have them) Mostly because the people I play with tend to charge headlong into the fray and close the distance too rapidly to make any use of LRMs for very long. But in my standard lance I ALWAYS have a mech with two LRM-15s one medium laser and the rest of the space for SRM-6s. I have found that if the missle mech focus solely on one target he does enough damage with the LRMs to turn the mech into scrap after a few solid volleys of SRMs, especially if he flanks them. And although I'm a Davion, I play Clanner style, mano a mano, so my missle boat is never ganged up on, hence the ability to put withering amounts of fire onto one target at a time.
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Hardware
Clan Ghost Bear
Star Colonel
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 605
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 18:04 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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You're looking at it the wrong way. It doesn't matter if the damage stacks in what order. I usually build up in damage rolls, starting with the small stuff and working my way up. Think about it this way. I've scrubbed off your armor with the missiles and lasers, now I'm rolling for location with a PPC or gauss, is that going to make the pucker factor higher or lower than the final roll being a single SRM?
My choice of weapons to fire will change once there is a hole open on your mech, since I use missiles as crit seekers, but the order I roll the damage in doesn't really matter until I can see myomer.
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2104
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 18:15 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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I like to look at it from a realism standpoint...which is more likely to impact first...an energy weapon traveling at (or at least close to) the speed of light...or a missile or ballistic weapon only traveling around a couple times the speed of sound...?
Ruger
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8081
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 20:23 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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Quote:
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On 2003-01-14 18:04, Hardware wrote:
I usually build up in damage rolls, starting with the small stuff and working my way up.
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This is why when Horhiro rolls dice for damage in a game he says "using the (Hardware) approved method of rolling the small weapons first..."
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 21:38 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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Quote:
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On 2003-01-14 14:24, Jade_Dragon wrote:
Every see what 350 LRMs do to a target when they hit?
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No. So what's your point? Have you ever seen what 100 ER PPC's do to a target when they hit?
For the tonnage LRM's are generally a poor alternative to lasers or the gauss rifle (I am talking IS here).
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5791
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Jan-2003 23:58 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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dunno.... i general get off better shots with LRM's..... but then the truth is, its all in the playing prefrence.
and please explain how a 10t LRM 20 is worse then a 15t Guass? that just struck me as an odd statement.
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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| Posted: 15-Jan-2003 00:30 Post subject: RE: LRM then Laser? or Laser then LRM? |
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The gauss is superior to the LRM 20 for several reasons:
)Concentrated damage has been proven to be more effective in combat than a wide dispertion of lower-powered shots. You guys might be into this whole "crit-seeking" strategy, or playing the odds at getting head shots, but I prefer concentrated firepower.
2) The LRM20 does not guarantee 20 points damage. The most likely result is 12 pts, unless you increase its weight by the addition of Narc's, etc. Even then you are still playing the odds.
3)The gauss can be tied to a TC.
If you start loading specialized warheads then LRM's can be decent. FASCAM rounds are pretty neat. But I generally try to eliminate elements of chance when I play, not add them.
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