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Nightmare
Lyran Alliance
Kommandant-General
Joined: 03-May-2002 00:00
Posts: 2214
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 Posted: 12-Oct-2002 02:21 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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Hitler`s Germany re-armed itself after WW I, and the rest of Europe just didn`t seem to notice anything for a long time. A lot of their early tank development, for instance, was funded and tested out under false names. "Heavy tractors", "Medium Tractors" and the like. The Kriegsmarine planned several ships under false labels too, and the Luftwaffe got their pilots trained in the extensive hobby piloting clubs that were started almost immediately after WW I. Some war schools were outside Germany, on Soviet territory, in full cooperation with Stalin.
Thus Germany managed to rebuild their warmachine while they outwardly followed all the limits placed on them by the Versailles treaty. No more than 100,000 men divided between a small standing army and even smaller defensive navy. No flying stuff was allowed...IIRC, the peace treaty was signed in 1919, and when Hitler denounced it in 1935 the Wehrmacht was already quite strong. They also got a few veterans of their own when they sent volunteers to fight in the Spanish civil war 1937.
And that`s in Europe, which isn`t very big compared to the whole Inner Sphere and Periphery. Hiding troops and training facilities isn`t impossible, it`s actually so easy that it isn`t funny. Falsifying manufacturing records for known factories isn`t exactly hard either, but quite hard to detect unless you`re actively looking for such manipulation. Hidden factories won`t need that, as long as you can get raw materials for them without alerting anyone. That shouldn`t really be hard either. As a certain Admiral said, "My Lord, there are so many uncharted systems"....How many small wars can the wobblies use for training out there in the deep periphery? They can certainly have a good proportion of veterans of their own.
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A tree fall in the forest, and no one is around, and it hits a mime. Does anyone care?
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Nightmare
Lyran Alliance
Kommandant-General
Joined: 03-May-2002 00:00
Posts: 2214
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| Posted: 12-Oct-2002 13:43 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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BTW, as for surprising the Dragoons...
Outreach system is three days from jump point to planet, and there`s also a lot of perfectly legal traffic. Outreach imported a lot of materials for the different mechs and vehicles produced there. Why would it be so hard to smuggle in something extra, such as a couple of small nukes? Especially if they can be hidden in a big block of equipment that`s supposed to be delivered anyway?
Imports come from these locations, as of 3065 listing on http://www.ncwebsurfer.com/croutoncommand/3060HTML/ORFrame.HTML
Betelgeuse (CC)
Fletcher (FWL)
Hesperus II (LA)
Kalidasa (FWL)
Kathil (FS)
MacIntosh (FS)
Mendham (FS)
New Earth (LA)
Nirasaki (DC)
Orestes (FRR)
Robinson (FS)
Sterope (TC)
Taurus (TC)
Terra (Chaos March, Wobblies)
Wallis (FWL)
Mostly electronics and weapons, although there`s also Valiant Lamellor armor...
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A tree fall in the forest, and no one is around, and it hits a mime. Does anyone care?
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Bear
Royal Black Watch Regiment
Recruit
Joined: 11-Oct-2002 00:00
Posts: 4
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| Posted: 12-Oct-2002 18:15 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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As per the most recent messages all I have to say is....
I am certain that there was plenty of public trans on the day the Widowmakers bought the farm...as for smuggling 'small nukes'...yea I am sure the Dragoon custom Officers thought nothing of the small boxes mark calculators....
The justifaction continues....
I rest my case.....
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2104
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| Posted: 12-Oct-2002 21:31 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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Unless the Dragoons have each and every LaGrange Point bugged and watched every minute of every day, for every planet in the system, it is ENTIRELY possible to smuggle even a large fleet into the system...detection ranges on the jump emissions only extend out a few million miles (IIRC from what someone said was in the Explorer Corps sourcebook, which is one that I'm sorry I don't have at the moment)...beyond that, they can't be detected...apply a small bit of thrust to overcome inertia, and you can let your momentum coast you in...you become nothing more than a big rock in space...unless their sensor grids extend out in a complete sphere, you can get through...and nukes can be made small enough to fit into brief cases...which can be sensor shielded...
Then there is the possiblity that some of the sensor grid is knocked out just as they come in...of some of the WarShips being in drydock for maintainance...of the Blakists coming in with 20 or 30 WarShips (remember the Marik secret fleet?) to the Dragoons meager half dozen (likely less)...etc....
It's no different from terrorists taking over three airplanes, and then flying them into the sides of three seperate buildings (one of which is the a major military installation and is actually the last building hit, after you already have the warning of the other two impacts), while still on radar, completely detectable...can't be done? I direct you to September 11, 2001...
Or perhaps having a huge flight of planes come into bomb one of your most important military installations, even after being detected by your radar installations...reference December 7, 1941...
However, I suggest everyone just wait until we see what is actually done...and in the meantime, just remember that what happens on Outreach and much of the rest of the Sphere had been planned out many years ago, and only minor tweaks have been recently made...
Ruger
[ This Message was edited by: Ruger on 2002-10-13 00:43 ]
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Slythis
Federated Suns
Colonel
Joined: 09-Aug-2002 00:00
Posts: 712
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| Posted: 13-Oct-2002 00:01 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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or what about the possiblity of firing off the Nukes from outside the sensor range? if you fire off enough of them it doesn't really matter where they hit so you don't really need propelent beyond getting the nukes going in the right direction. Remember, almost no friction in space, you don't need to use thrust to get there... as long as you're not in a big hurry.
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js
Federated Suns
Sergeant-Major
Joined: 25-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 125
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| Posted: 13-Oct-2002 11:25 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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We don't actually know how big the attacks are yet. We know that the WoBblies manage to secure roughly the area of the old Terran Hegemony and attack at least one House capital world (New Avalon). We therefore assume that other capital worlds and industrial centers are attacked. We know that at no time do they ever succeed at taking a significantly larger chunk of the IS than the future RotS. That's not a lot to go on - and it certainly does not look impossible to me.
While this is pure speculation, I expect that the WoBblies are getting a lot of help. The FWL is an obvious source. I also think the Skye Separatists and possibly the Northwind Highlanders have been duped into helping out. Reasoning: a) The Separatists have 2 WarShips and lots of support in Skye. Duke Robert knows he now has no chance of becoming Archon - but leader of an independent Skye must still look attractive. b) Northwind was not nuked. They are probably peeved that the new SL is not quite what the old one was. It shouldn't be too hard to get these 2 groups to help out. They wouldn't hear the truth about the WoBbly plans, of course (d'oh).
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MEX
Clan Blood Spirit
Star Colonel
Joined: 21-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 440
Location: Austria
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| Posted: 17-Oct-2003 03:52 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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Quote:
| On 2002-10-13 11:25, js wrote:
While this is pure speculation, I expect that the WoBblies are getting a lot of help. .... I also think ... the Northwind Highlanders have been duped into helping out. Reasoning: a) .... b) Northwind was not nuked. They are probably peeved that the new SL is not quite what the old one was... |
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If your family lives on a world like Northwind, deep in territory controlled by Wobbies, i am sure that you wont stand up and fight against WoB !
MfG, MEX
[ This Message was edited by: MEX on 2003-10-17 03:56 ]
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Quentil
ComStar
Recruit
Joined: 15-Feb-2003 00:00
Posts: 2
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| Posted: 17-Oct-2003 15:46 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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Quote:
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On 2003-10-17 03:52, MEX wrote:
If your family lives on a world like Northwind, deep in territory controlled by Wobbies, i am sure that you wont stand up and fight against WoB !
MfG, MEX
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Or it might make you stand up and fight harder.
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But what do I know, I'm just a Periphery bum.
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8081
Location: United States
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| Posted: 17-Oct-2003 16:12 Post subject: RE: Ideas on where WoB is getting the manpower... |
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Sorry, but neither of those posts was worth opening a year old thread.
Topic locked.
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