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tom kazansky
Federated Suns
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Joined: 11-Jan-2007 00:00
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 Posted: 31-Aug-2007 00:31 Post subject: What current nations do the Great Houses seem to resemble? |
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I was wondering if any of you have ever thought about what modern nations the Inner Sphere's Great Houses seem to resemble. This is my perspective:
Federated Suns: United States
I think this one's pretty obvious, since the book that comes with the game says they are "the banner-bearers of liberty in an otherwise benighted universe" and "the military powerhouse of the Inner Sphere." Also it seems like they are more or less the frontrunners of the Inner Sphere in just about everything.
Draconis Combine: Japan
This one's even more obvious than the Federated Suns. Not much else to say here.
Cappelian Confederation: Communist China
Another obvious one.
Free World's League: European Union
House Marik seems to be a overly bureaucratic, largely irrelevant non-state just like the modern-day EU.
Lyran Alliance: Germany/Switzerland
I'd say this since they seem to combine the German's love for huge machines and military muscle-flexing with the Swiss' economic prowess. Plus it is called House Steiner so there's definately got to be some Germanic influence there.
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Mordel
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| Posted: 31-Aug-2007 10:14 Post subject: |
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I think your guesses are pretty much in-line with what I was thinking.
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
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| Posted: 31-Aug-2007 14:53 Post subject: |
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Federated Suns: Yeah, the states at the moment. Can't say that I like the FS, but that would go to the saloon.
Lyran Alliance: Prussian Empire and Austria before WWI. Commerce, orientation on big things in military. The organization would be more like that of Austria in the same time (social generals, ...).
Draconis Combine: Japan before WWII. Strict government lead by military elites and traditions. Fanaticism included.
Capellan Confederation: Maoist China in the past, now there are reforms, but to what extent? Just like with the empire of the center, we don't know...
Free Worlds League: EU wouldn't be the the best example, since mot states want to me the part of it. Pre-WWI Austria or perhaps the British Empire (and other colonial powers) around WWII. Held together by central power, but the members are ready to revolt.
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Rudel Gurken
Allisters Light Thunder
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| Posted: 01-Sep-2007 04:12 Post subject: |
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I will second SD's opinion but i've seen Marik as a mirror of the Balkan.
Especially Ex-Yugoslavia, Greece, Bulgaria, Romania and yes maybe Austria/Hungary. States suffering from forced union to brutal regaining of independence several times over the last centuries.
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CO_17thRecon
Kell Hounds
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| Posted: 01-Sep-2007 11:14 Post subject: |
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Also, it should be noted that the Federated Suns is an amalgam of France, the United States, and Great Britain. Emphasis on common rights and noble rulers, for instance. Military ranks are English. The Davion family seems to have French ancestors, from what I can discern. The currency is the pound, etc.
I don't have the source book handy, but I might argue that the Federated Suns is on the line between resembling the UK more or resembling the US more. And there's just enough of a French influence that you can feel it.
I would also agree that the Free Worlds League is a bit more like the Balkans, or perhaps, the proto-state that came before the United States. I forget the exact details, but a loose confederation was attempted at first which didn't work so well. Of course, I could simply be reading too much into their favored use of the eagle as a symbol. The eagle is the symbol of many countries, after all, not just the Untied States.
I will defer to SD's opinion on the Lyran Commonwealth, he seems to know much more about the Prussian Empire and what not than I do. I can say I do still like the Lyrans. I shall have to play a Lyran character next time I get a chance to start the universe over...should make a good excuse to learn some German if nothing else. Anyway...
Draconis Combine and Capellan Confederation are easy, but do not forget that each one contains a sizable minority population, enough to make a "state" within a state. This would be the Azami Enclave for the Kuritans and the Tikonov Republic for the Capellans. These would be, of course, Arabic influenced, and Russian influenced, respectively.
Finally you have the Free Rasalhague Republic, which I believe is still a "major" state, despite small size. If size mattered, the Capellans would still likely be a minor state, but shrewdness of leaders cannot be underestimated. Anyway, they're quite obviously Swedish influenced, with a slight overlayer of Japanese culture from all the time under the Draconis Combine. They probably have the most interesting blend there.
The St. Ives Compact was probably similar to post-reform Taiwan, after the nationalists relaxed. Unfortunately, if BattleTech is a good predictor of real world events, then Taiwan is going to have serious issues in the next few decades.
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Rudel Gurken
Allisters Light Thunder
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Location: Germany
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| Posted: 01-Sep-2007 12:28 Post subject: |
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| CO_17thRecon wrote: |
Finally you have the Free Rasalhague Republic, which I believe is still a "major" state, despite small size. If size mattered, the Capellans would still likely be a minor state, but shrewdness of leaders cannot be underestimated. Anyway, they're quite obviously Swedish influenced, with a slight overlayer of Japanese culture from all the time under the Draconis Combine. They probably have the most interesting blend there. |
I would call it skandinavian (so Sweden, Norway, Island, Finland, Denmark) and a strong ancient Vikings influence
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The St. Ives Compact was probably similar to post-reform Taiwan, after the nationalists relaxed. Unfortunately, if BattleTech is a good predictor of real world events, then Taiwan is going to have serious issues in the next few decades. |
They have had already!! St Ives is no more!!
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Reality is where the Pizza-man comes from!'Gucken, petzen, verpissen!' (Look at it, squeal it, get the hell away from it!) – Motto of the recon troops'Artillery doesn´t know friend or foe! They only know worthwhile targets!‘ – Kuritan Infantrist
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
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| Posted: 01-Sep-2007 15:05 Post subject: |
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Well, I'm not sure whether I should call FRR a major power. Since they are now only a few planets with a lot of ComStar, Bears and some others around. Oh, and I didn't recall the correct order of letters in Rasalhague 
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CO_17thRecon
Kell Hounds
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| Posted: 02-Sep-2007 16:56 Post subject: |
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| Rudel Gurken wrote: | | CO_17thRecon wrote: |
The St. Ives Compact was probably similar to post-reform Taiwan, after the nationalists relaxed. Unfortunately, if BattleTech is a good predictor of real world events, then Taiwan is going to have serious issues in the next few decades. |
They have had already!! St Ives is no more!! |
If you reread, what I mentioned was, if real life imitates BattleTech, Taiwan is headed for serious problems in the next few decades. China is likely going to try the "Capellan Solution" sooner or later, but that's starting to get very off topic.
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SaberDance
Federated Suns
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| Posted: 03-Sep-2007 00:08 Post subject: |
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| Rudel Gurken wrote: | I will second SD's opinion but i've seen Marik as a mirror of the Balkan.
Especially Ex-Yugoslavia, Greece, Bulgaria, Romania and yes maybe Austria/Hungary. States suffering from forced union to brutal regaining of independence several times over the last centuries. |
I always envisioned the League as something akin to the AOS, or the Pacific Trade Organization. A group formed more or less out of what was left, with maybe one or two major powers that clustered the smaller ones around it.
Actually, given the pictures of Marik in the old books, I always imagined a heavy southern hemisphere influence on Marik.
Tell me about this French influence on Davion. I never saw any more French influence than would be expected as the left-overs of 1066. I imagined Davion as the Anglo-sphere (could the French be the Quebecois in the 31st century?) with Steiner as the Continentals.
And is the Royal Black Watch Federated Suns or Lyran Alliance? I had it in mind it was Lyran.
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tom kazansky
Federated Suns
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| Posted: 03-Sep-2007 10:26 Post subject: |
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| I agree with Saber Dance. I don't see any French influence at all in the Federated Suns. I think in both the manual that comes with the game and in their sourcebook that Davion is strongly pushed as the "Americans" of the Inner Sphere.
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CO_17thRecon
Kell Hounds
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| Posted: 04-Sep-2007 01:06 Post subject: |
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Ugh, research. Well, I don't have house books handy, so I'll use some minor supporting evidence from Mechwarrior 3rd Ed as well as some conjecture. If I can get my lazy self to actually do more research though, I'm sure there's more than this. Also, in my defense, I said there was some French influence, I didn't say it was permeating.
Secondary languages for a FedSuns character are French, German, Hindi and Russian. First off, this is the only major nation to have specifically labeled French as a secondary language. (Save the Taurian Concordant and Outworlds Alliance, if you consider them major. But they share a "close" border with the FedSuns.) If the languages are listed in terms of prevalence, then the FedSuns would have the greatest percentage of native French speakers. This suggests, although does not necessarily prove, a cultural link to Terran France.
Next, and this could be a sticky point, the repetition of red, white and blue as national colors. These are the national colors of America, the United Kingdom, and France, among various other nations of Terra. Consider the Davion Brigade of Guards paint scheme...blue, white, red, white, blue. Given the large vertical stripes of color, I would suggest this is a symbolic of a link to France, again, due to similarity to the French flag. You could also make the case for it being somewhat close to the Union Jack, I suppose, but it's certainly not all that similar to the American flag, which features horizontal stripes.
...I intended to look up more, but I'll leave it at that, as well as the belief that the Davion surname is based upon French pronunciation, if not actually French. I never said I saw a lot of French there, just some. I would rank the Federated Suns influences as United Kingdom, United States, France, it that order. France being a distant third really. But given their general dedication to freedom and liberty (although they had quite a few bloody revolutions and coups before agreeing what it was), they seem to be in line with Federated thinking.
I realize this conjecture is sketchy at best, but I'm not truly trying to convince anyone, merely display my thoughts. And frankly, true proof or disproof would come from reading the old source books and new source books, and I don't think I have the time or inclincation to do so at this moment.
If I ever do happen to do the research, I will post what I find.
And the Royal Black Watch is Star League. They serve the First Lord only.
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"What the...?! Where did you get THAT?!"
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SaberDance
Federated Suns
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| Posted: 07-Sep-2007 16:49 Post subject: |
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Interesting.
I don't know that I see a lot of Modern France in it. As I said before, just the left-overs of 1066 and the Quebecois, but interesting nonetheless.
There is something to the Davion/French Blue-White-and Red, rather than the Anglosphere Red-White-and-Blue, I think I can see that.
Thanks.
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AWAD
Draconis Combine
Chu-sa
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 20-Sep-2007 17:11 Post subject: |
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So what is Comstar?
The UN with Blue Helemets with Guns that will use them?
Maybe the US, Inner Sphere policeman? Or boogyman?
Outworlds Alliance- German Confederation of hte 1600-1800 in terms of organization but early colonies of the the Americas in terms of feel, indivdualists, different ideals and goals.
Taurians- America of the Old West in terms of rugged individualism.
Magistry- Not sure at all.
Marians- More like early Byzantium than Rome.
AWAD- need to think about it a little more
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
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| Posted: 21-Sep-2007 04:51 Post subject: |
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The old ComStar is an obvious replica of the catholic church of the middle ages. Wealth, owns property all around the known world without having much on it's own officially, inquisition, subtle influence, knowledge possession and distribution control and world saviour included. Newer ComStar simply went through the reformation. It's power is waning and it tries to influence the states through good advice often backed by good amount of population's voice. Trying to support the state rather than control it openly, so I would say that new ComStar moved to neo-Enlightenment era, while the WoB maintains the public facade of the same but in core it's a more hardcore church of the baroque, like the one that operated in Spain or here during forced recatholization... the worst tales about the Jesuits concentrated...
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mud
Draconis Combine
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2007 12:30 Post subject: |
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| CO_17thRecon wrote: |
...I intended to look up more, but I'll leave it at that, as well as the belief that the Davion surname is based upon French pronunciation, if not actually French. I never said I saw a lot of French there, just some. I would rank the Federated Suns influences as United Kingdom, United States, France, it that order. France being a distant third really. But given their general dedication to freedom and liberty (although they had quite a few bloody revolutions and coups before agreeing what it was), they seem to be in line with Federated thinking.
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The Davion House book traces the Davion lineage back to one Marshal d'Avion of 18th century France, so yes, I'd say that the Davion's themselves are of French descent.
All of the houses are multi-national and multi-cultural, either as a result of settlement patterns, or as a result of conquest. The Federated Suns Capellan March, for example, is composed of planets which were originally Capellan. Because of the feudal structure of government in the Inner Sphere, you have to assume that a lot of the institutional and cultural Capellan substrate remained intact after the Davion conquest.
The Draconis Combine is an interesting example. The culture of the elite is clearly based on the culture of Japan's Tokugawa Shogunate, but persons of non-Japanese descent can and do reach position of great authority in the state and military, as long as they are willing to assimilate to the culture promoted by the Kurita family. In some cases, this can include taking on a Japanese name, as was the case with Minobu Tetsuhara, who was of African descent, but this is not a necessity, as demonstrated by generals like Vassily Cherenkov or Greg Samsonov.
| Sleeping Dragon wrote: | | The old ComStar is an obvious replica of the catholic church of the middle ages. Wealth, owns property all around the known world without having much on it's own officially, inquisition, subtle influence, knowledge possession and distribution control and world saviour included. Newer ComStar simply went through the reformation. It's power is waning and it tries to influence the states through good advice often backed by good amount of population's voice. Trying to support the state rather than control it openly, so I would say that new ComStar moved to neo-Enlightenment era, while the WoB maintains the public facade of the same but in core it's a more hardcore church of the baroque, like the one that operated in Spain or here during forced recatholization... the worst tales about the Jesuits concentrated... |
Another influence on Comstar I think comes from the Spacing Guild in Dune. The Frank Herbert influence is a lot more blatant in Warhammer 40K, but there are bits and pieces of it in Battletech as well.
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